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well, you've all certainly argued in favor of the grid. you've got the grid. what's the problem then?
the credits can be reimbursed over 5 years. if you don't pay enough taxes to get the benefit over that time period - then why are you complaining about all the taxes you pay that subsidize these credits?
police station in pahoa has solar panels.
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quote:
the credits can be reimbursed over 5 years.
Again, assumes you have the capital to build the system in the first place.
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there is affordable financing for systems from many local banks.
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quote:
Originally posted by Jay Bondesen
Somehow I don't think forcing every grocery store, gas station, fire department, hospital, telephone company, and auto shop, to run on generators would be an improvement. Storage systems just aren't quite there yet to operate them 24/7 using just the sun. I wonder what those services would cost without the grid? You also have to wonder what the tax base would be if there were no grid. Who would visit, live, or open a business to pay taxes? What kind of subsidies could it pay for?
Jay
This isn't true, steve linked a system built in 1994 by humboldt state university that split water using solar panels and stored the hydrogen in tanks. This system had incredible output and was reasonably affordable.
(See: http://www.dangerouslaboratories.org/h2homesystem.pdf )
It's not that the technology isn't available, its corporate private interest in collusion with legislative exhange councils that force our governments policy down our throats and keep everyone reliant on fossil fuel technologies. Misinformation and a general lack of a credible outlet for any new innovations keeps the status quo.
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The post I think is about geothermal and HELCO putting out an RFP. There is maybe some confusion about the RFP being about expansion or lower prices. Some think geothermal is a lower cost supplement to power the grid 24 hours a day, just as photovoltaic panels provide supplemental power to the grid during the daytime. As can wind and other more experimental sources. Keep in mind that the subsidized panels, seen on many businesses and the police station, are only useful as long as there is a grid. None are really intended to be stand alone operations such as what can be done on a much smaller scale. I think we need a functional grid, the question is how to supply it in a safe and reasonably priced way.
Jay
Jay
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Wrong again, the panels are useful without a grid - for splitting water via electrolysis.
The "grid" is antiquated technology developed over a century ago.
Funny how resistant people are to new technology / ideas - don't bother to read about alternative technology to fossil fuels - just nod as the politicians tell you that none of it will "work with the grid" - duh the grid is ancient!
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The grid is a dinosaur headed for extinction. New technologies are already here(look up the "Bloom Energy Box"), and technology is developing exponentially. Who knows what the next decade or two will bring? The primary reason that HELCO holds on so tenuously to it's archaic 1890's grid system is CONTROL/PROFIT.
As more and more people discover that alternative home systems and mini grids are affordable; more and more people will be unhooking.... leaving the gridosaurs holding the bag.
HELCO is obligated to maximize profits to it's shareholders; but the public certainly isn't obligated ignore new technology for them to do so.
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PUC gets letter from Malama Solomon - FYI: (Snipped - More at links)
This appeared in a national/international publication (Local article below: Hawaii 24/7). She does bring some valid points to light on this issue, and the PUC has yet to respond to this letter. At least she calls out the PUC & HECO to make sense of this RFP. We the taxpayer, ratepayer, deserve lower rates and more from our "public utility". I also applaud the existing "wheeling" docket being raised. JMO.
http://thinkgeoenergy.com/archives/18124
Senator Malama Solomon from the State of Hawaii, released a letter yesterday that she sent to the Public Utilities Commission and Boston Pacific Company, Inc., the latter was the consultant managing the RFP process on behalf of HELCO. The letter questions and requests clarification of the delay in awarding a contract for the development of a 50-megawatt geothermal project on Hawaii Island by Hawaiian Electric Company (HECO) and Hawaii Electric Light Company, Inc. (HELCO).
“I am alarmed that HECO and HELCO have now consumed close to three years in a process that included a “request for information” and a “request for proposals” related to geothermal power generations,” Solomon, who represents Senate District 4 – Hilo, Hamakua, Kohala, Waimea, Waikoloa, Kona, said in the letter sent on January 23, 2014.
In February 2013, HELCO issued a Geothermal Request for Proposals (RFP), but several months later, on December 20, 2013, the utility company announced that “Hawaii Electric Light has determined that none of the submitted bids sufficiently meet both the low-cost and technical requirements of the Geothermal RFP.” HELCO was expected to award the contract last August or September.
Solomon, in the letter to Chair Hermina M. Morita and PUC commissioners, called this a unilateral and unjustified determination by HECO.
“For the past several years,” continued Solomon, “consumers on Hawaii Island have sought to expedite the production of affordable renewable geothermal energy…geothermal development has not progressed because HELCO/HECO have refused to retire their old fossil fuel plants in order to integrate cheaper renewable energy, including geothermal energy, onto the grid.”
Solomon identified “bad faith actions” taken by HELCO/HECO including their failure to submit an Integrated Resource Plan (IRP) that was compliant with specific industry framework requirements.
“I strongly believe the recent actions of HECO/HELCO in the Geothermal 50-megawatt RFP demonstrate that HECO is intent on delaying (and/or preventing) geothermal development on Hawaii Island,” said Solomon. “This is due to HECO’s preference for fossil fuel and bio fuels for its own plants to the detriment of the development and integration of other renewable sources for energy.”
In the letter, Solomon also asserted that she had been told that the “RFP was a confused mess that did not conform to industry standards and that it required information from bidders based on data that HECO failed to provide.”
She goes on to say that industry experts have claimed that the RFP contained unrealistic operating requirements making it impossible for bidders to advance pricing structures that would benefit the ratepayer and make it economically feasible for a developer.
Solomon urged the PUC to consider reactivating the 2007 Docket on Wheeling in order to provide energy producers and ratepayers with options that can be met by private sector energy transmitters and developers. She also requested information on the qualifications and experience of Boston Pacific Company, Inc., the Independent Observer, claiming a lack of notable hands-on experience in geothermal energy production and transmission.
In addition, Solomon questioned HECO’s criticism of the price structure for ratepayers offered by the geothermal bidders when HECO and the PUC have recently approved an agreement with Hu Honua Bioenergy LLC setting rates at a high of $253 per megawatt hour. She asked whether the bids tendered for the Geothermal RFP were lower or higher than this figure and by how much.
“The PUC has an affirmative obligation to address this matter; the time has come for the State regulatory agencies and bodies to stop supporting the HECO monopoly and to act to protect the interests of its residents and ratepayers,” Solomon said in ending the letter. ”
The letter is very interesting to read and sheds light on the rather strange RFP process that maybe was designed to “delay (and/ or prevent) geothermal development on Hawaii Island” (so Senator Solomon in her letter).
The letter can be downloaded here.
Source: Senator Malama Solomon letter via her website, the actual letter (pdf)
Hawaii 24/7 article link: http://www.hawaii247.com/2014/03/03/sena...mal-plant/
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FYI: Here is HELCO's response to the Independent Observer (referenced above):
The following document has been filed with the Hawaii Public Utilities Commission for Docket: 2012-0092. Click here to view this document or go to the DMS web site at http://dms.puc.hawaii.gov/dms/ to view all of the documents
Date Filed: 03/05/2014
Title: Letter From: J. Ignacio To: Commission Re: Docket No. 2012-0092; Hawai'i Electric Light Company, Inc.'s Response to Memorandum from Independent Observer dated February 21, 2014
Number of Pages: 14
peteadams, geochem: Spot on. JMO.
This news is some what surprising to me? Thought this Puna geothermal(helco) experiment was really heading forward and nothing could stop more of it?. I was wondering how this area could have more geothermals transferring more electricity when my electric at home continues to go off regularly (couple times a month)?. I even replaced my meter box, breakers, and lines just a couple months ago because things fried up with surges. After replacing everything we have noticed a small drop in our bill and we are not getting those surges. Had helco come out when we did the work, They found the problem in the back of their meter. Yet we had to pay for the entire expense(not cheap). Our electric has gone out at least 8 times in the last 2-3 months since we did this job, so were glad we took care of the problems. I think the electric goes off (more) the closer you live to Geothermal, and cost more too.
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