Potential restrictions to Mauna Kea access

[dmbwest]

Gypsy,
Yer gettin' worse man ... I hope your kids not suffering as a result of this.

[punaticbychoice]

gypsy69:
Get back on your meds please.
I think the whole TMT protest is orchestrated by OHA etc, dialing for dollars.
I support the TMT. A seven year legal process was gone through to get to the point
of construction.
What is going on now it could be said, is extortion and blackmail.

[beepbeep]

I think the TMT has been successfully used as a rallying point. Definitely some are envisioning money and power. Land ownership, rents, reparations, sovereignty, other non-astronomical issues. I do believe Hawaiian kupuna would have wanted the telescopes and that this is just not really about what they would have wanted as far as telescopes go. If there had to be a rallying point wish it had been something else.

I don't understand this water issue that keeps coming up. Can someone please explain?

And a medical emergency is more important than any protest.

Pam in CA

[beepbeep]

Oh, wasn't the bullet hole thing disproved? Would a Nobel prize destroy the Hawaiian culture? And where is all this money telescopes are supposedly making. How do telescopes make money, bake sales?

Pam in CA

[terracore]

"And where is all this money telescopes are supposedly making. How do telescopes make money, bake sales?"

You've never seen those big binoculars at sight-seeing places like the Grand Canyon or Mt. Rushmore where you put a quarter in, and for a few minutes you can look through them? Big telescopes are like that, except that they only take $100 bills.

Telescopes don't "make money", they discover the universe. The river of cash that flows to Hawaii from those who want to build and operate telescopes here is paid out in a variety of ways (jobs, scholarships, grants, endowments, etc). And also that slot that takes $100 bills.

[beepbeep]

The TMT harm to aquifer thing: an inaccurate claim:
http://www.tmt.org/news-center/thirty-me...background

Pam in CA

[beepbeep]

Oh no Terracore, I've looked without paying my $100!!!

Guilty!

I don't know why there is this persistent myth that telescopes make money. Maybe because those who are paying for the TMT are giving money to Hawaii...the thought is that there's more where that came from. More more more!

Pam in CA

[punaticbychoice]

beepbeep@ 19:04:39-
I agree.

[Guest]

Took advantage of the beautiful day and got outdoors. Got to take my oldest golfing at the waikaloa village, hot and windy. We did stop at the rest area half way up saddle. We both noticed what looked to be several new steel water tanks less than 1 mile from this new park. Also appeared to be a few more large water tanks within a mile from the military base. The holding tanks look to be up the slopes of maunakea, is the water being diverted and piped down from maunakea( fresh springs)? I am afraid maunakeas life force (water) is being taken, stored, and used for ?.

Well if the Tmt is built on maunakea we then could see up to a million visitors a year reach the summit. This could have a few more people needing emergency response or help at times on the mountain. Seems like a high altitude helicopter landing pad would be on the Tmt priority list? Could help transport equipment or workers as well when the road is blocked by locals or rocks.

I Enjoyed playing with my son and chasing my little white ball all day. Also did not have to yell four, or punch anyone in the face for a nice change.

[TomK]

"Gee beepbeep, you're playing with words to suit your agenda methinks."

[...]

"Now maybe Toms dinky little scope is running on a bare bones budget but hey that's because it's archaic and should be retired."

And yet that "dinky little scope" is currently the most scientifically productive telescope on the planet, and in terms of scientific impact for all telescopes, third only to the HET and Kecks. I don't think it's Pam playing with words to suit an agenda.

http://aspbooks.org/publications/492/090.pdf