Project to collect feedback about Mauna Kea..

[kalakoa]

what might be possible 100 years from now atop Mauna Kea's summit

Nothing, if the "protectors" have their way.

[Guest]

Hawaii should make sure that Mauna Kea, Hawaiians, and their culture are indeed protected or preserved 100 years from now. As it stands today, continuing in this current heavy developmental period of time atop Mauna Kea and throughout Hawaii. The TMT's expected operational life span atop Mauna Kea is longer than the Hawaiian race has left here on earth, Jmo.

http://www.bigislandvideonews.com/2016/0...mauna-kea/

Its happening everyday around all of us, we see more and more folks from hawaii leaving the islands or becoming homeless. Their Usually local folks with a mixed race that includes some Hawaiian. These types of very large telescope like the TMT's project really should be studied first elsewhere. Before introducing its impacts to a fragile environment like Mauna Kea's, or its unrecognized And already declining Hawaiian race. Just an opinion or concern from one very white haole who grew up in hawaii, where most of my good friends or extended family are very Proud Hawaiians without land.

[kalakoa]

more and more folks from hawaii leaving the islands or becoming homeless

Problem: depressed economy, high cost-of-living, limited local opportunity.

the TMT's project really should be studied first elsewhere

Solution: don't attract investment to our economy, don't create local jobs.

[opihikao]

A presentation will be made at Imiloa tomorrow evening (6/29) from 5:30-7:30pm (free), as part of the "Imiakea Series". I also look forward to future presentations, from other groups, who have mana'o to add to this discussion. Mahalo, Imiloa for providing this venue.

Hiki no!


FWIW/JMO.


"Imiakea Series"

(*Snipped - More at link)

http://tinyurl.com/z6gtfm9


Join us for June’s ‘Imiakea Series: ‘O Hanau Ka Po la Luna: A Presentation on Hawaiian Worldviews and Relationship to Mauna Kea
by Brea Aamoth on June 15th, 2016


Date: Wed. June 29
Time: 5:30pm – 7:30pm (doors open at 5:15pm)
Location: ‘Imiloa’s Moanahoku Hall
Cost: Free

A Presentation on Hawaiian Worldviews and Relationship to Mauna Kea.

Join us for the third event in our ‘Imiakea series, which is aimed at expanding our understanding of all that Mauna Kea represents.

This month’s event features ‘O Hanau Ka Po la Luna, a chant that honors the birth of Kamehameha III and traces his lineage to Hawai‘i Island’s natural landscape.

A section of this chant describes the birth of a mauna (mountain) of “Kea,” which many Hawaiian scholars and practitioners have associated with the creation of Mauna Kea on the island of Hawai‘i.

ETA: delete all those "^*%$#%#^(699" things... [xx(]

[opihikao]

quote:

---

Originally posted by gypsy69

Hawaii should make sure that Mauna Kea, Hawaiians, and their culture are indeed protected or preserved 100 years from now. As it stands today, continuing in this current heavy developmental period of time atop Mauna Kea and throughout Hawaii. The TMT's expected operational life span atop Mauna Kea is longer than the Hawaiian race has left here on earth, Jmo.

http://www.bigislandvideonews.com/2016/0...mauna-kea/

Its happening everyday around all of us, we see more and more folks from hawaii leaving the islands or becoming homeless. Their Usually local folks with a mixed race that includes some Hawaiian. These types of very large telescope like the TMT's project really should be studied first elsewhere. Before introducing its impacts to a fragile environment like Mauna Kea's, or its unrecognized And already declining Hawaiian race. Just an opinion or concern from one very white haole who grew up in hawaii, where most of my good friends or extended family are very Proud Hawaiians without land.

---

Aloha ahiahi, Gypsy. Mahalo for your continued support of Hawaiian people, albeit, raw, and perhaps offensive to some here. (For the record, I do not agree with everything you post; a'ole. Still, there are those few "pearls of wisdom" I continue to find in your posts...[])

We (our ohana) still hang onto what has been passed on (land) through Kupuna, which includes basic charges/assignment of kuleana, and aloha aina. We have exorbitant land taxes, including land which is in the designated "Conservation" zone (ocean front from Kupuna; 6-7 generations ago...), limiting the use thereof.

Much like Mauna Kea (in a "Conservation" zoned area), we adhere to the rules and regulations set forth by the law. ALL entities should/must follow the law of the land; at this point (since 1959, and until further notice), US law.

At this point, as Papa said on his deathbed, (First charge: "Take care of Tutu". Then...) "protect our land, for generations to come".

That is what all who live here, flourish here, retire here, and make Moku o Keawe "home", should focus on. Dakine is right, in that respect: Long term planning, "for generations to come".

Aloha to you and your ohana, as always.


JMO.

ETA: Typo; clarity

[TomK]

quote:

---

Originally posted by gypsy69

Speaking about projects wanting to collect Data or INFO?
A concern about the TMT project i have is that Mauna Kea's summit becomes a tourist trashed target like Pearl Harbor has,jmo. I don't want to see our next generations once calm and peaceful mountain used to possibly help weaponize space or be an important part of a missile defense system or a world Quick strike nuclear "deterrent" plan. After hearing that China a strong "TMT partner" Boldly shot down their own broken or outdated satilite from space, made me question what kind of "DATA" the Chinese may have been protecting. Jmo.
NASA does have a $8 billion dollar plus "JWST" getting ready to be launched in the year 2018. This JWST could have some "DATA" worth saving, recollecting, or protecting around the time the ?? billion dollar TMT project is scheduled to be complete. Would the TMT atop Mauna kea be working, receiving, or sharing space Data with this new NASA space satilite jwst?

---

Saving this nonsense for the future. Gypsy isn't trolling, these are the ravings of a lunatic.

[opihikao]

quote:

---

Originally posted by TomK

quote:

---

Originally posted by gypsy69

Speaking about projects wanting to collect Data or INFO? ...

---

Saving this nonsense for the future. Gypsy isn't trolling, these are the ravings of a lunatic.

---

(*Snipped for brevity) Aloha ahiahi, Mr. Tom. Completely understand, given the statement made. (Gypsy, please understand this kind of unfounded position reaps this response from Mr. Tom. No pearls here, Gypsy. Sorry.)

Frankly, I don't care what information is shared with what country, what is utilized for "security", what is deciphered, gleaned, edited for media (propaganda), nor if "Hangar 18" is down the damn street!

The biggest concern I have is when digging two (2) stories down into Mauna Kea, that the law states, the land must be returned to "the original state when leased (not prior to)" (not verbatim, but damn close; we use it in all of our AG leases) at the end of the lease. Now, under US law, and the master lease (and the sub-lease), how is TMT or any other observatory in the future going to adhere to that condition?

Going to rest now, tomorrow is another day to "collect feedback about Mauna Kea". SMH. (Again)

JMO.

ETA; clarity/re: Lease language

[TomK]

There are many sciences that involve collaborations between scientists from all over the world. Astronomy is a particularly good example of a scientific field that brings nations together through those collaborations. This has nothing to do with governments or the military, the observatories have no connection with either other than some get funding through various government agencies - none connected to the military.

With a few minutes spent researching his position on the internet, Gypsy could have made an informed and intelligent post. He chose not to and post a whole bunch of misinformation, incoherent arguments and blatant lies instead. Stuff he's brought up before and has been answered. Now it's:

Tourists -> weaponize space -> missile defense -> nuclear deterrent -> TMT.

Sometimes it's just right to call a spade a spade and not wrap it in cotton wool.

[opihikao]

(*Waiting for the hot water heater, since mo'opuna used ALL the hot water![xx(])

Mr. Tom, you said, "Sometimes it's just right to call a spade a spade and not wrap it in cotton wool." (BBM)

Daddy (English/Irish/Hawaiian man) used that term an age ago! Miss my Dad immensely, mahalo for the memory... We (my ohana) call a "spade a spade", to a fault (obviously...lol)), Sir.

Then, it's...Que sera sera, in essence (ala Doris Day[]):


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZbKHDPPrrc


OK, the water is now hot. Aloha ahiahi, moe me ka maluhia lani (sleep well). More "feedback" tomorrow. (Apologies for the OT, again, however, levity helps at times.)

JMO.

[Guest]

TomK, thank you sir for the laugh this morning. You sir are right once again, I did choose not to post anything informed, intelligent, or with any pearls added. TomK, I may have mentioned this in other unkind ways a time or two in the past, please do your own damn homework, pack up, and start this decommissioning of those scopes yourself.
I did at first try to post a legitimate opinion or two regarding this thread's topic. Tom, as usual you ripped my opinion about Dakine Or Opihikao possibly being part of this new groups panel, while also adding no substance to yet another thread. Why the belittling personal attacks? Instead of firing back at you personally, I felt compelled to help you choose something stiffer to drink tonight. Try this TomK, stop trolling folks with your negative personal attacks and stick to the threads you can add something of good or useful substance. In return I'll promise to regain my peaceful or calm qualities and not try to bring up my many Military concerns regarding this TmT project being atop our Mauna Kea.