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quote:
Originally posted by PaulW
Palanakonu - things have changed recently. Now you have to show proof of Hawaii residency, before that was not necessary.
I'm not sure what else you have to show now, you probably know better than me!
I've moved around a bit in my life, the most I have ever had to show was just a current valid operator's permit and any post bill with your name and address... Hawai'i is the first place I needed to show a lease.
For the record, I presented them with my current lease, license, social security card, and electric bill... nothing more was necessary - not even taking the written test.
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LOL @ Reminds me of what Linda Lingle's Big Island rep explained to me..... the way they deal with Puna is to get everyone arguing and simply walk away.
I'm not sure why people are obsessed with the DUI/license aspect, but it's not unusual to be able to get a state ID without proving residence status. In the last 8 years or so states have been making this more and more difficult. However their concern isn't so much your immigration status. Lacking my social security card, I tried to use my US passport in lieu of the SS card. The DMV refused to accept that and I was only in the US for 1 week specifically to renew my drivers license. It was rediculous.
It was then after arguing with the manager that I realized they didn't care about my residency status but rather that I was signed up for social security and paying into the system. I think this is why when illegals can easily obtain others' social security cards when applying for jobs they look the other way because they can collect the taxes but don't need to pay out the benefits. It's also the same reason that many employers don't use e-verify and ignore visa statuses too. They don't have to pay out any of the expenses or really worry about minimum employment requirements.
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In the last 8 years or so states have been making this more and more difficult.
Feds really wanted a "national ID card" but this would never fly, so they simply nationalized the existing State DL/ID system by passing "minimum requirements".
States which do not comply will find that their IDs are no longer considered "valid for Federal purposes".
tried to use my US passport in lieu of the SS card
This is valid; I've done it. Requirement is "documentation of legal presence", passport is actually the best document for this purpose.
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I think this is why when illegals can easily obtain others' social security cards..
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Which is also identity theft. If someone uses your SS number in a fraudulent manner, see how difficult it is to get it straightened out.
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quote:
Originally posted by kalakoa
tried to use my US passport in lieu of the SS card
This is valid; I've done it. Requirement is "documentation of legal presence", passport is actually the best document for this purpose.
Oh believe me I know. They accepted the passport as an additional "form of id" but they still required the SS card. Granted, this was only 1 year into the new requirements at the time and perhaps they were still trying to get their DMV policies ironed out, but it was ridiculous.
I had to go the local SS office, which was no longer authorized to issue SS cards because they now came from a secure centralized facility (haha). So they checked my status and wrote a form letter verifying my SS # and indicating a replacement card was being processed.
The DMV refused to allow this letter as verification or substitution for my SS card and I insisted they call the SS office (3 blocks away) which they refused. I then contacted the state's main DMV office, got them on the phone and they told the local manger that if I could prove I was leaving the country before my SS Card would arrive then they would issue the license.
So I had to go home to get my tickets and drive back. After scanning my tickets, the official letter from the SS department, my passport, my "bills mailed to a local address", and my previous driver's license (recently expired from another state) and two other forms of photo ID into the DMV system, I was given a new license (after taking the tests).
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if I could prove I was leaving the country before my SS Card would arrive then they would issue the license
Exactly. If you can photoshop an SS card, you can photoshop some plane tickets.
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I probably didn't help my cause because I openly laughed when they kept insisting they needed the SS card because my passport wasn't enough. The SS card has got to be one of the easiest things to forge and are actively traded on the streets because the government and businesses see fake social security card use as a win-win.
Forging my tickets (not just an e-ticket or boarding pass, I had the real deal old-school style) would have been much harder than just making a fake SS card. I was appalled when they wouldn't take the signed letter from the SS department proving my SS # was legit.
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appalled when they wouldn't take the signed letter from the SS department
I just love "discretion". Safe bet that a different location (or same location, different day, different staff) would have come up with a different answer.
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Good debate here. Some responses to miscellaneous comments:
From Paul W: Should deportation become the new standard of punishment...Got a DUI?..Off to Australia with you on the ships, just like the old days.
The comparison is not correct. The illegals are being returned to their countries of origin. Australia (in the beginning) was a penal colony. (A similar logic is being used by critics who compare our border wall to the Berlin Wall. The latter kept people in. Our wall keeps people out. I guess open-immigration folks believe this inconvenient fact can be ignored.)
From Kapoho Joe: I expect someone here illegally..to hold themselves to a higher standard. Kinda how I expect a bank robber (or any other criminal) to lay low. Correct. And they and their supporters should not be lobbying for the right to enter illegally.
Terracore’s statement: The media narrative...has been to blur the distinction between "immigrants" and "illegal immigrants". Emphatic Yes.
By the way, I like the word discrimination. Websters: the act of making or perceiving a difference (other definitions follow). Such as discriminating, or distinguishing, between different things. Whether we act discriminatory--and to what extent--after perceiving a difference is a separate question, but astoundingly, Social Justice Warriors are now attacking the idea that we should even be able to discern differences among social groups. Astute reply by media commentator Sam Harris to SJWs who objected to his (free) speech regarding immigration: “You have to be able to criticize bad ideas.” In the opinions of some folks, apparently not.
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quote:
Originally posted by MarkD
From Paul W: Should deportation become the new standard of punishment...Got a DUI?..Off to Australia with you on the ships, just like the old days.
Actually I said that and you didn't get the context right. People here seem to think instant deportation is something an illegal alien deserves if they have ever done something wrong, even if they were punished for it once already. My statement was to take this logic to the next level to see if they felt this was really fair. If you MarkD (assuming you're a US citizen) got a DUI, would it then be fair to ship your criminal self off to Australia after all your years of working and building a life here?
And they and their supporters should not be lobbying for the right to enter illegally.
No one is making that argument.
Emphatic Yes [The media narrative...has been to blur the distinction between "immigrants" and "illegal immigrants".].
Not really. If anything the media has made a bigger deal about illegal immigrants in the past 20 years than ever before. To the point where people are arming themselves and patrolling boarders in their paranoia. As I referenced Bush Jr. and Obama have deported more people than the entire history of deportations. This is a recent phenomenon and the attention it has been getting might make it
feel like there is sympathy, but the fact is America has always had their hands out to try and help immigrants. Recently however we've decided to demonize the poorest of them who have almost zero way to come here legally. And likewise there has always been a loud minority rallying against any type of immigrant (Irish, Jewish, Syrian, etc.) Did you watch that 1947 film I linked from the US War Department?
In the 105 years between 1892 and 1997, the U.S. deported 2.1 million people — meaning that under presidents Bush and Obama, the number of people deported by the U.S. in the course of a century was more than doubled in just 16 years of consecutive presidencies.
