Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
1819 versus 1893
#11
quote:
Originally posted by HereOnThePrimalEdge

how it applies to the current situation, unless it is just to confuse it seems to have no redeeming value. The people today are Hawaiians in 2019

So, 1893 applies to the current situation and contributes to the conversation.
1819 however, does not apply to the current situation and has no redeeming value.

For future reference, would you provide the cutoff date?


Stop and think about what you've asked. Now what would make the time periods different? There's a pretty significant event that happened in 1893 that totally changed Hawaiians right to self determine right?
Reply
#12
There's a pretty significant event that happened in 1893 that totally changed Hawaiians right to self determine right?

Yes.
But is 1893 the one and only event that totally changed Hawaiian rights? Or were there others, as in 1819?

After Hawaiian religion and cultural practices were banned in 1819, the one thread of their culture that prevailed continuously in the background against the decree of the monarchy was hula. Sometimes they danced behind closed doors, sometimes the monarchy allowed public performances under government regulation. Kalakaua finally encouraged open, legal, public dancing in the late 1800’s. Other practices saw a renaissance during this period, but not all. It wasn’t until the 1970’s that Hawaiians began a period of rediscovery for their lost history, culture, and religion. Fortunately most was never completely lost as many practitioners had continued their work in defiance of the edicts made by earlier rulers.

Question: who was right during the time Hawaiian culture was banned? Those who followed Hawaiian self determination as decreed by the monarchy, or those who disregarded the laws and disobeyed the monarchy?
(It’s a rhetorical question)
"I'm at that stage in life where I stay out of discussions. Even if you say 1+1=5, you're right - have fun." - Keanu Reeves
Reply
#13
As a Nation, yes.
Reply
#14
Do any of the protesters/protectors go to Christian churches? Seems like there are quite a few Christian churches in Hawaii and not a word from the churches about this issue.
OTOH
Are there any other religious sites in the world that would cause an uproar if something big was built on (or near) them?

Puna: Our roosters crow first
Puna: Our roosters crow first
Reply
#15
100 Religious Leaders Release Statement of Solidarity with Kanaka

From: http://bigislandnow.com/2019/07/20/100-r...th-kanaka/

The Pacific Justice and Reconciliation Center and others created a statement in light of the recent Thirty Meter Telescope protests and arrests atop Mauna Kea—the 100 Religious Leaders Statement of Solidarity —and delivered it to Gov. David Ige on the morning of Friday, July 19, 2019.

The statement (see below) was also distributed to other State of Hawaii officials, and through the media to county officials and agencies, and the University of Hawaii.

It will also be transmitted through social media and religious news to local, national, and global social justice networks and news.

The group's letter statement is the result of two days of discussions, organizing, mobilization and collaborations.

The statement of solidarity campaign began on July 17, the morning 33 kupuna (elders) were arrested in an act of civil disobedience protecting Mauna Kea.

In the two days following the gatherings at Mauna Kea, gatherings have taken place on all of Hawaii's islands, and from Alaska to Maine.

This statement of solidarity was "born to give prayers, voice, and support to Kanaka Maoli protecting Sacred Mauna Kea."

The 100 Religious Leaders in Solidarity are individuals representing themselves, and the organizations listed are for affiliation purposes only. Some of these religious organizations are beginning to discuss and develop organizational statements and positions of their own, and educational resources, strategies and actions.

The 100 religious leaders in the statement include leadership in the Hawaii District of the United Methodist Church, and Resident Bishop of Los Angeles, leaders in the Association of Hawaiian Evangelical Churches, and the Hawaii Conference of the United Churches of Christ, The Episcopal Church of Hawaii, and the Indigenous Ministries Missioner, and members of the Indigenous Ministries of the Episcopal Church, and the Hawaii Pacific Islands and Asian American Ministries of the United Churches of Christ...

More at link above.
Reply
#16
Where were all these politicians and religious leaders during the contested case hearings? They only speak now when they can jump in front of a parade.

ETA: Should have said circus, not parade.
Reply
#17
Where were all these ... religious leaders during the contested case hearings?

The Christian religious leaders are the descendants of the very people who repressed the Hawaiian culture for the last 200 years. They were laying low so as not to bring attention on themselves. Now, questions are being asked and they realize they might come under scrutiny.

MarkP, a circus is a good description - - with clowns and magicians who perform sleight of hand and misdirection so we don't see the manner in which they accomplish their tricks.

With 200 years of practice, they're pretty good at it.
"I'm at that stage in life where I stay out of discussions. Even if you say 1+1=5, you're right - have fun." - Keanu Reeves
Reply
#18
The Christian religious leaders are the descendants of the very people who repressed the Hawaiian culture for the last 200 years.

Oh yeah, that's your take is it? I admit all sorts of humbug through the years, but your statement sure doesn't take reality into consideration. Not any reality I know.

Here's an article, a bit dated - from 2011, of one Christian religious leader I know personally that would suggest your opinion is biased, again, by your own prejudice.

https://keolamagazine.com/people/daniel-...-akaka-jr/
Reply
#19
quote:
Originally posted by HereOnThePrimalEdge

Where were all these ... religious leaders during the contested case hearings?

The Christian religious leaders are the descendants of the very people who repressed the Hawaiian culture for the last 200 years. They were laying low so as not to bring attention on themselves. Now, questions are being asked and they realize they might come under scrutiny.

MarkP, a circus is a good description - - with clowns and magicians who perform sleight of hand and misdirection so we don't see the manner in which they accomplish their tricks.

With 200 years of practice, they're pretty good at it.


some clarification please hopte...MarkP in his post seems to reference the protectors...you seem to reference the Christian religious leaders...who? is pretty good at it after practicing for 200 years??

eta...never mind...its those trickster Christians working both sides again...I agree, pretty good at it and doing very well to this day
Reply
#20
your statement sure doesn't take reality into consideration. Not any reality I know.

You never read good Christian people describe any of the following?

* lewd, suggestive dancing...
* bare breasted, immoral dress...
* lascivious practices...

If not, I can post a reading list.
"I'm at that stage in life where I stay out of discussions. Even if you say 1+1=5, you're right - have fun." - Keanu Reeves
Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 8 Guest(s)