DHHL is seeking a private attorney

[Frank]

quote:

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Originally posted by TomK

You do realize the university does research other than astronomy?

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yes...the headline from the story...University: Losing Hawaii telescope risks billions in funds

I did not see anything there referencing research projects in other depts..

[Frank]

quote:

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Originally posted by randomq

Frank, page 3:

https://dhhl.hawaii.gov/wp-content/uploa...140212.pdf

- Provided $600 million to DHHL in $30
million annual installments
- Last payment to be received June 2015

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yeah, looks to me like it was presented as a Solution to past shortcomings on the part of the State...gonna take a better look...thanks

[Frank]

I retract the $600 million from the conversation...


On the development side, the Act 14 land settlement reached in 1995 has provided for a stream of payments to DHHL of $30 million over the past 18 years.

above from...http://dhhl.hawaii.gov/2013/05/08/department-responds-to-star-advertiser-articles/

[Kaimana]

About damn time. They needed an outside counsel when they settled on the stolen land. The States appraiser said fair market value was $1 billion. While $600 million seems like a lot, it was still a 40% discount.

It's a huge conflict of interest for the States counsel to be the counsel for DHHL. DHHL's only purpose is to get beneficiaries on the land and protect the trust for the beneficiaries. The States goals seldom a line with DHHL's.

[TomK]

Frank,

Sorry, I'm becoming a little fed up with your assumptions.

"yes...the headline from the story...University: Losing Hawaii telescope risks billions in funds

I did not see anything there referencing research projects in other depts.."

From West Hawaii Today:

"Syrmos said he’s also worried the failure to secure the TMT at Maunakea will affect research funding for other sciences, including the university’s top research-dollar generator, oceanography.

“How we’re going to be seen from the outside, I cannot predict. It is possible our reputation will be tarnished. How federal agencies look at us in making investments is to be seen, ” he said.

The larger programs are the ones most likely to be affected, he said. “When an agency is going start to put 30, 40, 50, 100 million dollars, they’re going to have to vet us extremely well nowadays.”"

https://www.westhawaiitoday.com/2019/09/...o-with-it/

The billions of dollars he referred to was research grant money coming in over the next few decades and the $430 million was from research activities throughout the university which involves many research departments of which astronomy is only one. Other research programs bring in more grant money than astronomy.

Lastly, RCUH is essentially an employment agency for some researchers involved with work done by the university. Syrmos is a board member but not an RCUH employee. I have no idea why you brought up RCUH in this discussion.

[TomK]

"It's a huge conflict of interest for the States counsel to be the counsel for DHHL. DHHL's only purpose is to get beneficiaries on the land and protect the trust for the beneficiaries. The States goals seldom a line with DHHL's."

I don't know enough law to really make a sensible comment about this, but I think some people forget that the DHHL is a state agency, so it's not unreasonable to have the state AG be responsible for legal advice. Whether that's a conflict of interest or something else, I'll leave to others.

[randomq]

The state's appraiser needs to talk to the tax man. If empty DHHL land is worth billions, just imagine what Parker Ranch or Kamehameha Schools/Bishop Estates lands are worth. If taxed properly they could provide more services for everyone!

"It's a huge conflict of interest for the States counsel to be the counsel for DHHL. DHHL's only purpose is to get beneficiaries on the land and protect the trust for the beneficiaries. The States goals seldom a line with DHHL's." -- Kaimana

If only DHHL actually turned lands over to beneficiaries to live on, we wouldn't be stuck with a corrupt DHHL, people on the wait list for decades, lands remaining dormant to be stolen, etc. Instead of DHHL leasing lands for commercial development and squandering the income, it could be native Hawaiians leasing the lands and putting money back into their communities. Vote to disband the DHHL, take their remaining trusts and assets and put in roads, and divide the lots up among native Hawaiians, fee-simple. Maybe put CC&Rs that the lots may only be sold to citizens born in Hawaii, or second generation born here, etc.

[Frank]

quote:

---

Originally posted by TomK

Frank,

Sorry, I'm becoming a little fed up with your assumptions.

"yes...the headline from the story...University: Losing Hawaii telescope risks billions in funds

I did not see anything there referencing research projects in other depts.."

From West Hawaii Today:

"Syrmos said he’s also worried the failure to secure the TMT at Maunakea will affect research funding for other sciences, including the university’s top research-dollar generator, oceanography.

“How we’re going to be seen from the outside, I cannot predict. It is possible our reputation will be tarnished. How federal agencies look at us in making investments is to be seen, ” he said.

The larger programs are the ones most likely to be affected, he said. “When an agency is going start to put 30, 40, 50, 100 million dollars, they’re going to have to vet us extremely well nowadays.”"

https://www.westhawaiitoday.com/2019/09/...o-with-it/

The billions of dollars he referred to was research grant money coming in over the next few decades and the $430 million was from research activities throughout the university which involves many research departments of which astronomy is only one. Other research programs bring in more grant money than astronomy.

Lastly, RCUH is essentially an employment agency for some researchers involved with work done by the university. Syrmos is a board member but not an RCUH employee. I have no idea why you brought up RCUH in this discussion.

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why the RCUH??????? you ask...

The mission of RCUH is to support the research and training programs of the University of Hawaii and to enhance research, development, and training generally in Hawaii.
above taken from link ...http://www.hawaii.edu/ors/training/PI_Orientation/archived_version/v1/documents/M4T2P1_rcuh_org_chart.pdf

you can interpret the mission statement how you wish..the AG lends legal counsel to this agency...the agency is part division of the AG

YOU being fed up is a BIG problem...

[Kaimana]

Tom-I don't know enough law to really make a sensible comment about this, but I think some people forget that the DHHL is a state agency, so it's not unreasonable to have the state AG be responsible for legal advice. Whether that's a conflict of interest or something else, I'll leave to others.

It's really confusing because the HHCA is a federal act but the State is in charge of managing it.

The state's appraiser needs to talk to the tax man. If empty DHHL land is worth billions, just imagine what Parker Ranch or Kamehameha Schools/Bishop Estates lands are worth. If taxed properly they could provide more services for everyone!

If only DHHL actually turned lands over to beneficiaries to live on, we wouldn't be stuck with a corrupt DHHL, people on the wait list for decades, lands remaining dormant to be stolen, etc. Instead of DHHL leasing lands for commercial development and squandering the income, it could be native Hawaiians leasing the lands and putting money back into their communities. Vote to disband the DHHL, take their remaining trusts and assets and put in roads, and divide the lots up among native Hawaiians, fee-simple. Maybe put CC&Rs that the lots may only be sold to citizens born in Hawaii, or second generation born here, etc.

I don't know, the State took over 16,000 acres. 1 billion seems about right considering the price of an acre on O'ahu.

Also I agree with you on DHHL messing up. Part of it is that they for some reason have to put in all the infrastructure before allowing people to get their lots. Like the Maku'u lots on the Ainaloa side of the road aren't being given out because there isn't county water installed throughout the subdivision. They should lower their standards and just start giving out the land. There's more than enough to give to every beneficiary on the list an acre. Even if people can't afford to build on it at least they'll have it to pass to their kids or grandkids who might have the money and more importantly the credit scores to use the land.

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

They should lower their standards and just start giving out the land.

Kaimana,
It would be an interesting research study to find out how many Native Hawaiians are priced out of DHHL lots on Big Island, and then buy a property in Ainaloa or Hawaiian Beaches for example. If there were a good number who bought what was affordable so their family could own something, it would bolster the argument that DHHL should provide lower standard homesteads for their Native Hawaiian beneficiaries. If their intended beneficiaies buy in non-conforming subdivisions anyway.