11-19-2007, 06:54 PM
It is Monday..late Monday, but Monday non the less.
I have read each post and will try to include each in my post.
Daniel P- asked about companies working together.
We have come to some basic agreements with other operators but not to the extent that would address specific flight path and altitude limits. I find that we tend to be a higher than other aircraft most of the time but believe this is offset by the fact that we have 10 aircraft on the Big Island while the next largest has 3. We have tried to establish some basic limitations and routes but find we are the only ones using them. I have talked to the other operators and frankly, they tend to not to do what we do so as to avoid the traffic. I would likely do the same.
With regards to you question about routes, we do not go to the Caldera from Hilo. We fly to the Puu O'o vent and spend the majority of the time at the eruption site.
As far as climbing to 2000 ft, that is our current minimum altitude from the Mac Nut farm to the Forest reserve between HPP and Pahoa. When the weather permits we climb higher, 3000 to 4000 until the forest reserve. It would be nice to be able to do this on a regular basis but as you know we are limited by the cloud base. I also want to say that I am aware of a few of our pilots thinking that as long as they are at minimums, they are OK. Technically I suppose that is true, but it is not the way to operate in this situation.
Let me share a perspective on this issue that might help with understanding some of what takes place. We have a high percentage of pilots here now who have been in Hawaii for less than 2 years. They come here with a great deal of experience in a wide variety of operations. Their perspective of operations has worked for them everywhere they have been and they tend to want to do what has worked well for them in the past. The problems we face as a community stem from the somewhat unique circumstance of living on an Island, compounded with very large weather creating mountains. We as pilots have a limited amount of area to work with and a very busy operations environment. The basic rules for helicopters everywhere else do not provide for minimum altitudes anywhere near what we try to do here. 1500 feet above the ground is pretty much unheard of anywhere else in the country. In fact, that is usually avoided intentionally to stay away from low altitude fixed wing traffic. I am not trying to justify lower altitudes, just trying to explain that to most helicopter pilots, 1000 feet above the ground is considered sufficiently high enough to mitigate any problems with people on the ground. I have spoken with pilots who are actually surprised that they are causing problems and sincerely thought they were operating in a more than acceptable manner. When faced with restrictive routes and fast changing weather conditions, pilots often tend to make decisions based on past experience. For helicopter pilots, that past experience has always been to get low and slow when things are not going as planned. It is a hard habit to break. For most helicopter pilots 500 to 800 feet above the ground is considered normal enroute operations. We make a sincere effort to educate our staff with regards to the noise issues we face, but it takes time for them to change the way they think and even longer for them to change the habits they have had for most of their careers.
I will step up my efforts to monitor our operations here on the Big Island. I think we are doing a reasonably good job at following our procedures and I am more than willing to work on specific areas of concern. I intend to ask the pilot staff to read the posts that are made here so as to help them better understand the problem.
punapetah- asked about Real Estate flights. We are a full service Helicopter company and actually do a variety of work other than Tours. You can contact any of the operators and get a quote which is usually based on an hourly rate.
Kathy H and Mella mentioned the Helipad by the volcano.
There are many issues with that, zoning, infrastructure, fuel, power, construction etc. If this were put on the table I would hope it would be in an isolated area which would provide for routes over unpopulated areas. I do not remember the reason the discussion did not go very far as it was many years ago and I was not directly involved.
To address the "fuel" questions. The aircraft burns about 48 gallons per hour. Fuel is not a primary consideration with regards to the discussion about modifying our routes to and from the eruption site. Our flights are not that long and the modifications would likely not lengthen the overall flight time significantly.
bob orts - I have not seen much evidence of a free-for-all since back in the late 80's and early 90's. In fact I think on our worst day, we are operating much more conservatively than any where else in the country and will continue to change and improve. With regard to state and local regulations, the main problem is the need for standardization and continuity. It would be difficult to fly from one side of the country to the other if you had to learn separate regulations for each state and city you flew over.
carey - I will speak to the pilots about giving Keaau a wider birth. The tower uses the Mill at the intersection as a reporting point so traffic tends to converge there. We can stay farther off to the east side of town if that will help.
It is getting late; I will get back to this in the morning. Good night all and sleep well
Edited by - darl on 11/20/2007 06:01:54
I have read each post and will try to include each in my post.
Daniel P- asked about companies working together.
We have come to some basic agreements with other operators but not to the extent that would address specific flight path and altitude limits. I find that we tend to be a higher than other aircraft most of the time but believe this is offset by the fact that we have 10 aircraft on the Big Island while the next largest has 3. We have tried to establish some basic limitations and routes but find we are the only ones using them. I have talked to the other operators and frankly, they tend to not to do what we do so as to avoid the traffic. I would likely do the same.
With regards to you question about routes, we do not go to the Caldera from Hilo. We fly to the Puu O'o vent and spend the majority of the time at the eruption site.
As far as climbing to 2000 ft, that is our current minimum altitude from the Mac Nut farm to the Forest reserve between HPP and Pahoa. When the weather permits we climb higher, 3000 to 4000 until the forest reserve. It would be nice to be able to do this on a regular basis but as you know we are limited by the cloud base. I also want to say that I am aware of a few of our pilots thinking that as long as they are at minimums, they are OK. Technically I suppose that is true, but it is not the way to operate in this situation.
Let me share a perspective on this issue that might help with understanding some of what takes place. We have a high percentage of pilots here now who have been in Hawaii for less than 2 years. They come here with a great deal of experience in a wide variety of operations. Their perspective of operations has worked for them everywhere they have been and they tend to want to do what has worked well for them in the past. The problems we face as a community stem from the somewhat unique circumstance of living on an Island, compounded with very large weather creating mountains. We as pilots have a limited amount of area to work with and a very busy operations environment. The basic rules for helicopters everywhere else do not provide for minimum altitudes anywhere near what we try to do here. 1500 feet above the ground is pretty much unheard of anywhere else in the country. In fact, that is usually avoided intentionally to stay away from low altitude fixed wing traffic. I am not trying to justify lower altitudes, just trying to explain that to most helicopter pilots, 1000 feet above the ground is considered sufficiently high enough to mitigate any problems with people on the ground. I have spoken with pilots who are actually surprised that they are causing problems and sincerely thought they were operating in a more than acceptable manner. When faced with restrictive routes and fast changing weather conditions, pilots often tend to make decisions based on past experience. For helicopter pilots, that past experience has always been to get low and slow when things are not going as planned. It is a hard habit to break. For most helicopter pilots 500 to 800 feet above the ground is considered normal enroute operations. We make a sincere effort to educate our staff with regards to the noise issues we face, but it takes time for them to change the way they think and even longer for them to change the habits they have had for most of their careers.
I will step up my efforts to monitor our operations here on the Big Island. I think we are doing a reasonably good job at following our procedures and I am more than willing to work on specific areas of concern. I intend to ask the pilot staff to read the posts that are made here so as to help them better understand the problem.
punapetah- asked about Real Estate flights. We are a full service Helicopter company and actually do a variety of work other than Tours. You can contact any of the operators and get a quote which is usually based on an hourly rate.
Kathy H and Mella mentioned the Helipad by the volcano.
There are many issues with that, zoning, infrastructure, fuel, power, construction etc. If this were put on the table I would hope it would be in an isolated area which would provide for routes over unpopulated areas. I do not remember the reason the discussion did not go very far as it was many years ago and I was not directly involved.
To address the "fuel" questions. The aircraft burns about 48 gallons per hour. Fuel is not a primary consideration with regards to the discussion about modifying our routes to and from the eruption site. Our flights are not that long and the modifications would likely not lengthen the overall flight time significantly.
bob orts - I have not seen much evidence of a free-for-all since back in the late 80's and early 90's. In fact I think on our worst day, we are operating much more conservatively than any where else in the country and will continue to change and improve. With regard to state and local regulations, the main problem is the need for standardization and continuity. It would be difficult to fly from one side of the country to the other if you had to learn separate regulations for each state and city you flew over.
carey - I will speak to the pilots about giving Keaau a wider birth. The tower uses the Mill at the intersection as a reporting point so traffic tends to converge there. We can stay farther off to the east side of town if that will help.
It is getting late; I will get back to this in the morning. Good night all and sleep well
Edited by - darl on 11/20/2007 06:01:54
would be nice also. I would prefer some noise over my house(yuk) than have the peace of the kau desert ruined. The only downside to the desert hike is the ants, ants and more ants, but they didn't bite.