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Rat Lungworm question
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02-19-2009, 09:18 AM
Take a picture and post it. I'm sure someone will recognize it. A pic of both the fruit and leaf and the flower, if possible.
Pua`a S. FL Big Islander to be.
Pua`a
S. FL Big Islander to be.
02-19-2009, 04:40 PM
Hey, speaking of posting photos, how do Puna's rats measure up against the ratzilla critter pictured in the photo at this site? Giant rat caught in China http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnew...onceivable )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( A pleasant slideshow: http://www.thejoymovie.com )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'(
)'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'(
Astonishing skill! This archer is a real-life Legolas and then some! http://geekologie.com/2013/11/real-life-...rs-anc.php )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'(
02-19-2009, 05:39 PM
quote: That's no rat... that's a friggin nightmare! Damon Tucker's Weblog
02-19-2009, 07:14 PM
I know I may seem contrary, but when I see or hear of people self diagnosing themselves with rat lungworm, I have no more confidence in their diagnosis that they have had it than I do with the diagnosis provided by the health care professionals who thought patients didn't have it. So far it has been under-diagnosed but due to media attention I bet we are entering a phase where it will now be over-diagnosed. Sore neck? Yeah, you got it.... or it was from painting that ceiling over the weekend.
02-20-2009, 08:15 AM
There's a chance you're right, MarkP, but, when you take into consideration the fact that I had a sore neck when I slipped and fell on ice back in 1971, and DID have another when I guess I slept wrong a few years ago, I'm going with my original thoughts. And speaking of big, ugly rats, I wonder what they taste like (if cooked properly, of course).
02-20-2009, 08:51 AM
Rats are a delicacy in parts of West Africa, and the Romans kept mice in big clay jar warrens near their front doors to fatten them up to be deep fried. I think we even call that species the dormouse to this day.
Cheers, Jerry
02-20-2009, 09:30 AM
Wow! What a rat!
My question is can domestic animals like barnyard fowl harbor the parasites? And ingest it and poop it out. My chickens seem to tolerate the cooler temps these days here on the Leeward side but fare worse when it rains so I was thinking there might a parasite problem. My dog had a bad tapeworm problem- didn't need the vet to tell me that. So can you examine the feces for the lungworm too? Other people want to make friends- I just want to make money. James Cramer
02-20-2009, 12:32 PM
"My question is can domestic animals like barnyard fowl harbor the parasites?...can you examine the feces for the lungworm" It seems unlikely domestic animals like barnyard fowl harbor the actively reproducing adult form of the parasites, but pet rats certainly could -and perhaps other rodents like pet mice, hamsters, and gerbils, too, if they are closely related enough to the evolutionarily compatible A. cantonensis rat host. In rats the adult nematodes live in the cardioplumonary system and so could be detected either by dissection of the rat or by testing its feces for the presence of rat lungworm eggs. Eyeballing the feces of a rat or any other potential carrier would not do it- these eggs are microscopic and first need to be separated from the feces and concentrated so that one can use a microscope to spot them. The process involves mashing a specific quantity of feces together with a chemical, filtering it through a certain size grid, centrifuging the resulting slurry, micropippetting up a set volume of the concentrated helminth eggs, and then examining that droplet on a microscope slide. This allows an approximate quantitative estimate to be generated of the total worm burden in the infected host. A person also needs some training to be able to figure out what s/he is looking at in the microscope: there are hundreds of different types of common parasitic worm eggs but many of them are from harmless helminths or even from worms that are just root-parasites of plants that were eaten (a normal part of our food, in other words). [I used to routinely do exactly this laboratory procedure, in Indonesia and elsewhere, as part of my research --and sometimes helping out the local clinics-- is how I happen to know.] So, yes, if using the correct procedure, then the feces of any animal can be examined for rat lungworm eggs -but they are unlikely to be detected in the feces of any critter except rats (and perhaps in closely related rodents as well). According to experts with long experience and the scientific/medical literature, rat lungworm larvae (L3) die in any mammalian host other than rats (and possibly other rodents) before reaching adulthood but they cause a lot of trauma, allergic/inflammation response, and sepsis as they burrow around and eventually die (thus the problem). It is less clear what is going on inside birds which eat L3; in some birds, the worms clearly do injure and kill the bird ...but in other species it may be the L3 die without doing much or any harm. Personally, I cannot see how Puna's mynah birds, ducks, chickens, Guineafowl, and peafowl manage to survive unless they have some protective factor vis a vis rat lungworm larvae, since they are certainly eating loads of them inside slugs. This is a masters thesis project or a doctoral dissertation project waiting to happen if any profs at UH have grad students ready to take such on. )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( A pleasant slideshow: http://www.thejoymovie.com )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'(
)'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'(
Astonishing skill! This archer is a real-life Legolas and then some! http://geekologie.com/2013/11/real-life-...rs-anc.php )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'(
02-20-2009, 01:06 PM
Steven, you've been doing the community a lot of good with your efforts on this subject and I for one would like to thank you. This is a serious, complicated subject and I, and I'm sure many others, appreciate your helping to present the facts.
02-20-2009, 01:55 PM
I have to second what Mr. Smith just said above!
Our Council Lady in Puna just recently has put up $5,000 of her contingency fund to hire a person to do community consulting and education on this whole problem and AKsteven you sure would be a perfect person if you were here instead of AK. Damon Tucker's Weblog |
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