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New electrical codes are specifying special fire-prevention circuit breakers for any plugs that are in bedrooms. I would like to update mine. Anyone with experience having an electrician update their home with new AFIC (arc fault interrupter circuit breakers? I need someone to do this January 7 in HPP. Person has to be capable but license not required. They may also reach me at my cell 310 562 0362. Mahalo for any referrals.
John Maloney
310.562.0362
johnmaloney3@me.com
Hawaii Architect AR8082
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See if you can even find a breaker on the island i went looking for one a few month ago and clerks looked at me like i was nuts
They have been in the NEC for about 10 years
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John, I have found AFCI breakers at Home depot. Replacing existing breakers with AFCI's is relatively simple. This is easily a job you can do yourself, assuming your panel was wired correctly and there is enough slack in the neutral "white" wire to reach the AFCI breaker you wish to install. Simply turn off your main breaker to the panel, verify that there is no voltage present at the breaker you wish to replace. Open the breaker, remove hot lead, remove neutral wire for that circuit from buss bar. Remove old breaker. Install new breaker. Connect pigtail white wire from AFCI to the slot you removed the neutral wire for this circuit from on the neutral buss bar. Connect neutral wire for this circuit to the neutral terminal on the AFCI, Connect hot wire to the AFCI load terminal. turn on main breaker, turn on AFCI, perform breaker trip test as specified in breaker packaging. Installation instructions normally accompany each breaker and should be followed. The above instructions are general procedures and should not replace any instructions in the packaging. The data plate on your breaker panel will specfiy the type of breakers you need to fit that panel.
dick wilson
"Nothing is idiot proof,because idiots are so ingenious!"
dick wilson
"Nothing is idiot proof,because idiots are so ingenious!"
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John,
Your bedroom may consist of several circuits depending on how it was wired. In actuality with regard to the AFCI matter they were slated to revise and make all circuits (whole house) AFCI protected in addition to the old just bedroom requirement. The last set I purchased where about $80.00 each down slightly from the previous $120.00 a pop. I'm not sure if the whole house requirement will be implemented because of the high cost of the breakers and that might slow down the revision addition of the whole house requirement. But... if you're concerned with staying up with current code may as well have the whole house done at the same time and save a second trip back by your electrician.
This is what happens when we allow manufacturers to be the composition of the board which makes the codes. Sort of like allowing an active thief to handle ones home security system it's a huge conflict of interest and more about forcing sales of product than anything really legit.
E ho'a'o no i pau kuhihewa.
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I happened to have a Siemens Panel. No AFCI breakers to be found. Had to order off the internet. Best to buy your breakers on the mainland. Can usually get them for under $50.
Dan
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Unless there is a revision to NEC08 that I'm unaware of, essentially all occupied spaces not requiring GFCI require AFCI protection. PG 70-49, section 210.12. Normal cost for AFCI is in the 35 dollar range for 15 amp breakers. Mainland is a cheaper choice if you know what type of breaker your panel require.
dick wilson
"Nothing is idiot proof,because idiots are so ingenious!"
dick wilson
"Nothing is idiot proof,because idiots are so ingenious!"
Posts: 2,381
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Joined: Jun 2009
Dick,
Yeah... that's right, so they did do the revision in the 09 code it sounds. They evidently lowered the prices substantially after the revision went into effect because that was a huge concern and had many people fairly ticked off regarding the whole house issue and facing $1000 + for AFCI breakers in one panel. I haven't dealt with any electrical since early 08 and the word at the time was basically what you've expressed above for the 09 revision. I was talking about it with my electrician and suposedly the AFCI isn't reliably compatible with the GFCI so that wasn't to be included as it causes one or the other to trip randomly when used together. I'd imagine when they come up with a compatible version on one or the other they'll require it on the GFCI circuits also. Probably just a couple more years down the road.
Edit to add the following:
Actually... come to think of it, it was Dec 07 when I picked up that AFCI bedroom breaker set and the additional code revision was to be the 08 codes... time flies!
E ho'a'o no i pau kuhihewa.
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AFCIs for the whole house? Motors and AFCIs (even GFCI's nuisance trip on motor loads) do not play well together, unless they've changed in the last couple years.
Puna: Our roosters crow first
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That nuisance tripping of AFCI's is one reason almost everyone was opposed to the AFCI requirements, but the manufacturers apparently got it pushed thru. They will nuisance trip on motor start up occasionally, so the home owner gets to deal with it. One reason that if one didn't have to upgrade to current code I wouldn't do anymore than just sleeping area's in AFCI's, and nothing with a motor in the circuit. But thats just me.
dick wilson
"Nothing is idiot proof,because idiots are so ingenious!"
dick wilson
"Nothing is idiot proof,because idiots are so ingenious!"
Posts: 2,381
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Joined: Jun 2009
That makes sense too; the spark jump from the brush to the armature in the motor would be enough to induce a trip. Unfortunately it’s the same manufacturers who are making the products who compose the board which write the code. They can add anything they want to the code, will and have. Take a look at the number of receptacles now required through a house and the double GFCI kitchen circuits, the number of required receptacles in mandated areas, the separate dedicated circuits now required for the microwave, a tub spa motor and another for it's heater if installed, the circuit for the smoke detectors and all that extra wire now required to drive all those gadgets they have created and require to be installed.
Has it increased the safety of the home? Perhaps - to a very small degree it has, but it certainly does not justify making it a forced requirement. The required locations for receptacles now goes far beyond legitimate safety and moves into the realm of optimal wiring which is where they want every house to be in order to sell everything they create, they will soon justify optimal through safety in anyway they can concoct.
I'm glad I'm going off-grid and will be using many DC circuits that the code makers haven't had a chance to address in-depth yet nor have they had the chance to make many products for the circuits. It; time manufacturing interests will dominate the codes in that area too.
This is a good example as to why the constitution outlined how we elect people to government who are suppose to make the laws through votes etc and how when we allow the laws process to be abridged through ADOPTED codes it fails dead in its tracks and represents only special interest.
E ho'a'o no i pau kuhihewa.
