Daynas pronunciation thread

[dayna]

So there are lots of words I'd like to know.

I've spent 16 years learning Tlingit words here in Southeast Alaska.

For example Tlingit is pronounced Klink-et.

So I'd like to know my street name.

Kahauale'a Road.

Is is Ka (like in word company) How uh Lay uh? The uh as in uh oh!

Dayna

www.AvianNation.com

[csgray]

I have found this site to be very helpful for figuring out Hawaiian words.

http://wehewehe.org/

I have a terrible ear for languages so learning Hawaiian pronunciation has been a real struggle. One big help was when I realized that words and syllables never end in a consonant, I am still trying to figure out all the different vowel combinations though.

Carol

[missydog1]

quote:

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Originally posted by dayna

So there are lots of words I'd like to know.

I've spent 16 years learning Tlingit words here in Southeast Alaska.

For example Tlingit is pronounced Klink-et.

So I'd like to know my street name.

Kahauale'a Road.

Is is Ka (like in word company) How uh Lay uh? The uh as in uh oh!

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You will find it rewarding to get this under your belt. []

You are part right.
Kah - how - ah - lei - ah,

So not an "uh" sound and not like the vowels in company. Ah is the short A sound, as in Ma or Pa (except without a regional accent). Maybe a better example would be the scale notes Fa and La.

As for which syllable to emphasize, I have not heard that name spoken. It could be the KA or the HAU, or neither one.

As you get more into it, you will realize that the EI sound is not the same as the AY in lay, may, bay. On all those words, the Y does get semi-pronounced at the end in English, whereas in Hawaiian, you stop short of hitting that sound.

Similar with "hau" -- In HOW we do touch on the "whu" sound at the end, but in Hawaiian th W is not there; we only use it in the phonetic to illustrate the proper vowel sound.

Once you start listening to local speakers and repeating after them, you will realize that the tongue and mouth positions are not the same as for speaking English, so the phonetic spellings are only an approximation of the right sound. Mostly they work to give you the closest sound that we use in speaking English.

Actually the scale notes work for Hawaiian non-dipthong vowels quite well.

Do, re, mi, fa, so, la, ti, do

Those would be pronounced more or less the same in Hawaiian as when we sing the scale.

[Midnight Rambler]

quote:

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Originally posted by KathyH

As for which syllable to emphasize, I have not heard that name spoken. It could be the KA or the HAU, or neither one.

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It's ka-Hau-a-LE-a. The greatest stress is always on the next-to-last syllable, with lesser ones on alternating syllables before then, unless there is a kahako (macron) that indicates a long vowel (as in Manukā, or kahakō itself; hopefully those will display right...). Also, don't forget the glottal stop indicated by the 'okina, which as you said is sort of like "uh oh", except with "ah" in Kahauale'a.

Another thing that can complicate stresses is that some words (especially place names) are actually agglomerations of shorter ones, so you may need to be able to recognize some of the components in order to pronounce it correctly. For example, Keahialaka (the ahupuaa that Leilani Estates is on), would be pronounced KE-a-HI-a-LA-ka if it was one word. But it's actually ke-A-hi-a-LA-ka, because the name is derived from "ke ahi a Laka", the fire of Laka. Kahauale'a is a similar kind of name (the hau tree of Le'a), but the number of syllables is such that it doesn't matter.

quote:

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As you get more into it, you will realize that the EI sound is not the same as the AY in lay, may, bay. On all those words, the Y does get semi-pronounced at the end in English, whereas in Hawaiian, you stop short of hitting that sound.

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Distinguishing between Hawaiian -e- and -ei- can be difficult, but in this case it's only an -e- anyway, so there's even less. A good way to remember how the Hawaiian vowels are pronounced is that they're basically the same as in Italian words, except where modified by a kahakō.

[taropatch]

quote:

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A good way to remember how the Hawaiian vowels are pronounced is that they're basically the same as in Italian words, except where modified by a kahakō.

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Italian? It gets better than that. When I lived on the mainland I'd tell my friends that it is worth their while to master these vowel pronunciations. It basically works for Hawaiian, Japanese and Spanish. Can anyone verify if these vowel rules basically works for Portuguese, Chinese, Korean, Filipino, etc?

[dayna]

You guys are amaazing, I'm learning so much!

And as far as how the mouth forms the words? I get it. Tlignit the way I wrote it and said it are different. However I cannot write the way I say it due to the way my mouth forms the words. So that makes perfect sense.

Dayna

www.AvianNation.com

[hotinhawaii]

My understanding is that every vowel is pronounced only one way. When combined, as in au, both sounds are vocalized but quickly so that is may sound like "ow." If you say ah-oo quickly, that is the correct pronunciation.

[EightFingers]

That's my understanding as well - all the letters are pronounced, but some are pronounced a LOT faster than others.
I don't think I'll ever LEARN Hawaiian, best I can hope for is some words and phrases - and to not look TOO stupid speaking them.

[dayna]

My main focus of learning how to prounounce words in any language is respect. I'm sure I'll never learn Hawaiian, but I find that an easy way to show respect for a culture is to do my best to learn and properly pronounce the words I use.

I think Hawaiian is going to be a fun language to start to learn a little bit about! And everyone has been so nice helping me learn words.

Dayna

www.AvianNation.com

[Midnight Rambler]

I highly recommend the book "Place Names of Hawaii" as a starting point for learning Hawaiian words. It won't teach you any of the grammar of course, but it's interesting to learn the origins of place names, and you learn a lot of nouns and adjectives. All the listings are also available on wehewehe.org if you want to look up something specific, but it's nice to be able to just browse through.