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I agree with Jay regarding restraint. I don't see the problem of this topic in terms of rats or even guns. I see it as a case study in lack of judgment. One may argue that the shooter shows lack of judgment (my position) and is somewhat callous in imposing his POV on his neighbors. Another might argue that the person(s) who called the police showed lack of judgment although there seems to be agreement there was a perfect right make the call.
I see a lot of misdirection in the discussion. Puna is not Manhattan. Mean looking people looking at you. Whatever.
I think the gun rights argument stacks right up against the right of a family to live in peace in their home. Then there is the law. My vote is that people, especially a neighborhood full of children, should not have to be fearful. They should be able to enjoy their day, every day, without a neighbor providing any level of fear. Poor judgment is what bothers me about guns. People with poor judgment, people with gun fantasies (There's a new sheriff in town!). It's not about cars without tags, trash in the street, barking dogs.
I really don't mean to lay into Lack personally, I like him basically. In each of these topics though he has chosen to make himself point central so he gets to wear the example for good purpose or bad.
There seems for some reason to be simply disdainful of the complainer in this tale. Fantasy (self serving fantasy) about why the call to the police might have been made. I am glad the call was made. I will assume the call was made for the appropriate reason - no evidence otherwise. I am pleased the police responded to the complaint. I think the police showed good judgment in quickly getting to the source of the problem and letting Lack know, politely, what is and is not acceptable. Too bad he doesn't want to listen to them, looks like more calls to the police are in the future. It appears he wants to push people's buttons in his neighborhood and on Punaweb. His judgment.
Punaweb moderator
Assume the best and ask questions.
Punaweb moderator
Greg,
If a tree falls in the middle of the forest and no one is around to hear it did it make a noise? If I used rat shot and dispatched a rat to the hereafter and nobody heard the shot did I commit a deadly crime? If not, then perhaps a silencer would be the proper coarse of action. Oh no, can’t be doing that ether, silencers are illegal also. Society wants to hear the sound of gunfire so they have made laws against silencers. Communities want to hear the noise of any gun fired so that [the self appointed] regulators of the laws feel the powers in which to control us outlaws.
I’m going to take lots of what has been discussed in this tread the next time that I feel the need to murder something. Seeing that rat shot disturbs so many, I’m moving on to bigger and better ways of controlling the rodent population, at least on my property. I’ll attempt to build a better mouse trap, so to speak. So stay tunned and I’ll report back on THE DIRTY LITTLE RAT HUNT & ROUND-UP and the means that were used to terminate the little darlings. Any suggestion will be properly reviewed and then applied if deemed worthy.
tlackey@hawaii.rr.com
The Lack
Oh Rob, do you really live in a world like the one you project? Hard for someone like me to fathom, and what’s up with this statement?
Rob wrote:
I really don't mean to lay into Lack personally, I like him basically. In each of these topics though he has chosen to make himself point central so he gets to wear the example for good purpose or bad.
Golly gee Rob,
I take it that you don’t like my choice of topic. Is it because it’s not “warm and fuzzy?” I’m not interested in needle point or quilting, and I believe that I may be talking to myself if I posted something like this.
Good morning everyone guess what I found in my back yard today? A rodent that some pervert must have poisoned because it was as dead as a door nail. I called a few of my fine neighbors and we held hands and then held a burial service for the poor deceased creature. I wish people would just leave God’s poor defenseless creatures alone. We all said a little prayer and then retired to my lanai for some tea and cookies with a stimulating conversation on crochet. God bless you all and for those of you that care I’m hosting a tea Friday with father Flanagan as my guest speaker. He will be talking about the “rearing” of young boys and how to make them behave. Hope that you can all attend.
And this Rob,
I am pleased the police responded to the complaint. I think the police showed good judgment in quickly getting to the source of the problem and letting Lack know, politely, what is and is not acceptable. Too bad he doesn't want to listen to them, looks like more calls to the police are in the future. It appears he wants to push people's buttons in his neighborhood and on Punaweb. His judgment.
Rob, whose judgment would you prefer that I use. And if my topic’s are offensive please give me some guidelines as to the proper subject matter on this forum. It seems funny that so many people respond to the obtrusive subject matter. Could it be that they have an interest?
The Lack
Posts: 859
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Rob, no one has the "Right" to live without fear. That may be something they want and strive for, but as a society, we do not guarantee it.
By the way, I saw a guy (not very friendly looking guy) walking his pit bull down the middle of the street. Pit bulls scare me and are infinitely more unpredictable than a gun. I think they should be outlawed. [  ]
They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security
Benjamin Franklin
-----------------------------------------------------------
I do not believe that America is better than everybody else...
America "IS" everybody else.
The Wilder Side Of Hawaii
Posts: 485
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Hi Lack- this device might assist with both the rat control and keeping peace in the neighborhood (linked in the suggestion reposted below from the thread "best bait and trap for mongoose?" in Folder D: Farming & Gardening in Puna). I have more of an aversion to use of poisons than to shooting vermin, myself, but in the interest of good neighbor relations maybe there is a middle way?
"In Alaska we were having problems with squirrels getting into structures, chewing on sheetrock and wires, and making huge messes in attic spaces so set some traps. These traps are highly effective and several times stronger than they actually need to be to instantly kill any squirrel triggering the mechanism.
We had the traps screwed to buildings under eves way up high where a ladder was needed to reach them, but I have thought these traps would probably be useful for mongoose and rat control, both, down on the ground. The traps are pieces of stainless steel pipe which (for added safety and target-specificity) can be placed inside crates with holes in the crates just big enough for mongoose and rats to pass through but filter out and exclude cats, small dogs, and other such non-pest critters. MAKE COMPLETELY SURE THE TRAPS ARE PLACED SUCH THAT SMALL CHILDREN CANNOT GET A HAND INSIDE! Likewise, I am thinking the pipe traps could be placed inside rockpiles and buried under planks with holes just big enough for mongoose and rats to pass through but exclude farm animals and pets. Be careful with these, as they will seriously break your hand if you reach inside one while it is cocked. Best to wear leather gloves while cocking them, too.
http://www.bugspray.com/catalog/products/page1599.html
These traps are humane inasmuch as there is an instant kill and no suffering on the part of the animal- bang! Lights out.
PS - In the YouTube video clip showing how to cock the trap the guy keeps sticking his finger down by the trigger where the crossbar could nail it. Not a good idea. Even with gloves on I'd recommend keeping pointing fingers clear of that bar outside the pipe. The trap is more powerful than it looks in this clip. The "bait" he is talking about is a sticky paste of nuts and pecan paste (like pecan pie filling, but more viscous) they sell. Globs of that paste will stick to the top of the inside of the pipe trap, right over the plate the animal steps on to set it off. Squirrels, at least, dive straight for the stuff ...but it also smells like delicious candy to a human nose even from several feet away so, again, make sure you have the trap inside a milk crate hinged on one side and padlocked on the other to a piece of plywood or otherwise rigged so little kids cannot get at it. The pecan paste bait would be very attractive to small children as well as to rats or (I'd think) to mongoose."
A whole thread full of suggestions potentially useful to rat control is located at http://www.punaweb.org/Forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6347
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"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
Pres. John Adams, Scholar and Statesman
"There's a scientific reason to be concerned and there's a scientific reason to push for action. But there's no scientific reason to despair."
NASA climate analyst Gavin Schmidt
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Edited to provide correct link URL.
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Astonishing skill! This archer is a real-life Legolas and then some!
http://geekologie.com/2013/11/real-life-...rs-anc.php
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Posts: 96
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A lot of people in our area shoot pigs. The lots are bigger, but one still has to be careful to "shoot down". No one we know shoots rats, it would sound like a war was going on if they did. Snap traps work really well, heeding precautions for children and small pets, and can be re-used a number of times,. We are inundated with rats some years and catch up to 3 a day. One a day was voluntarily drowning in the large dog water bowl, as well. Some people make a trap with a pail of water so that the rat goes for the bait and then falls in. Seems like this would work great.
Interesting thing. Since we have had the semi-slug and the nematode that is in them and their slime, angiostrongylus cantonensis or rat lung worm, and since rats love to eat the disgusting things, we have seen very sick and strangely behaving rats. After the first year we had the semi-slug, we had hardly a rat. Now two years later, the rats came back big time in the early fall, the semi-slug started appearing big time again in November with the cool and wet, and voila, now hardly a rat. Possibility of something going on there.
Now, if we could just get some semi slug shot....
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There has been some rather large rats that have a propensity for harrassing and assaulting people in the town of Pahoa. This has been going on for many years and they seem to pick on the elderly and other defenseless and unsuspecting people. This has been going on for years and the police still can't or won't get this under control. They don't seem compelled have a cop on the street there at night! I've heard that some of these rats are actually related to the police hence their lack of motivation in apprehending these rats, now I'm not sure if this is actually the case or not, but i do know that it's still a ongoing problem. I imagine this must affect business as well.
This is the rat blog right ?
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I bet those rats live at the post office during the daylight hours, disquised as postal workers! And you are probably right, maybe they are also related to the police people.
quote:
Originally posted by Green
There has been some rather large rats that have a propensity for harrassing and assaulting people in the town of Pahoa. This has been going on for many years and they seem to pick on the elderly and other defenseless and unsuspecting people. This has been going on for years and the police still can't or won't get this under control. They don't seem compelled have a cop on the street there at night! I've heard that some of these rats are actually related to the police hence their lack of motivation in apprehending these rats, now I'm not sure if this is actually the case or not, but i do know that it's still a ongoing problem. I imagine this must affect business as well.
This is the rat blog right ?
Aloha au i Hawai`i,
devany
Devany Vickery-Davidson
East Bay Potters
www.eastbaypotters.com
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Joined: Dec 2006
Shekelpal wrote:
Interesting thing. Since we have had the semi-slug and the nematode that is in them and their slime, angiostrongylus cantonensis or rat lung worm, and since rats love to eat the disgusting things, we have seen very sick and strangely behaving rats. After the first year we had the semi-slug, we had hardly a rat. Now two years later, the rats came back big time in the early fall, the semi-slug started appearing big time again in November with the cool and wet, and voila, now hardly a rat. Possibility of something going on there.
Fascinating.
I wonder if there is a relationship between the rats and giant snails similar in some ways to that between wolves and moose on Isle Royale http://www.isleroyalewolf.org/data/data/womoabund.html or typical of lynx and snowshoe hares in the boral forest http://www.nhm.org/cats/P12/index.htm but complicated by the presence of the lungworm (and perhaps leptospirosis, as well) in snails possibly perturbing an otherwise straightforward predator-prey cyclic population pattern?
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"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
Pres. John Adams, Scholar and Statesman
"There's a scientific reason to be concerned and there's a scientific reason to push for action. But there's no scientific reason to despair."
NASA climate analyst Gavin Schmidt
)'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'(
)'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'( )'(
Astonishing skill! This archer is a real-life Legolas and then some!
http://geekologie.com/2013/11/real-life-...rs-anc.php
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Posts: 859
Threads: 10
Joined: May 2008
I am curious,
Is anyone calling the police on the kids (and adults) setting of the fireworks at all hours of the day and night this week? You know it might be a gun going off an not an m80.
They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security
Benjamin Franklin
-----------------------------------------------------------
I do not believe that America is better than everybody else...
America "IS" everybody else.
The Wilder Side Of Hawaii
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