Pointless thread

[leilanidude]

To receive a scholarship, one must apply. Most of the Ivy League schools have very few students who actually pay for that education. The vast majority of students actually attend for free courtesy of the vast endowments that those schools have.

[Guest]

Thanks again hotpe.

Interesting how my use of the word technology would make you think satilite, a working satilite at that too. There are probably thousands of working satilites, who knows how much other man made technology (space junk) we keep track or data of currently, probably expecting a bit more in the coming years too.
The way I understand the mirror complex or eye of the TMT, correct me if I am wrong please. The over 400 lenses or mirrors used by the tmt may be used together or separately and could be operated, manipulated, or controlled from afar( like from a military ship or sub in China waters?).

P.S. Question for you hotpe. Would pearl harbor or hawaii have been bombed or attacked the way it was if america did not invest,carry, or have so much of the then current technology sitting in or around that harbor at the time?

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

Interesting how my use of the word technology would make you think satilite

Are there other man made objects the TMT can see? You understand it cannot view anything on the ground, right?

Would pearl harbor or hawaii have been bombed or attacked the way it was if america did not ... have so much of the then current technology sitting in or around that harbor at the time?

Yes, it would have been bombed. Hawaii has a strategic location in the Pacific Ocean which Japan would have liked to control. The current technology at the time in Pearl Harbor was preventing Japan from invading Hawaii, so Japan tried to bomb it to make it possible for them to occupy the islands. However, American technology prevented Japan from conquering Hawaii. It's fortunate we had the latest technology to prevent a Japanese invasion, wouldn't you agree?

"How we spend our days is, of course, how we spend our lives." -Annie Dillard

[PunaMauka2]

Actually, the attack on Pearl Harbor was intended to quickly destroy and immobilize the US Pacific Fleet to prevent any interference with plans by the Japanese military forces to invade and occupy SE Asia for it's natural resources. The prevailing hope among Japanese military strategists was to buy enough time to establish a strong enough empire that by the time the US regained it's footing the Japanese would be so well entrenched that the US would opt to seek a negotiated peace rather than stomach a costly and difficult war of attrition across the Pacific.

Of course this has absolutely nothing remotely to do with the TMT. Perhaps a stronger connection could be found with The War of 1812.

[pahoated]

TMT might be too big for Hawaii. The reality is the observatories on top of Mauna Kea started with a promise of jobs and education, with employment of Hawaiians, fast forward almost 50 years and many of the astronomers have nothing but disparaging and condescending statements to make than "none of them are close to being qualified". The Astronomy program at UHH is only a Bachelors. I don't think there is a single Hawaiian doctorate astronomer at any of the observatories. They are a good source of income to the island/county because the astronomers funded by their governments are foreign tourists and they spend well while they are here. TMT would probably mean an increase in tourism but that is a double edged sword.

At this point, it really is up to TMT Corp. to sell their product. You state government fixated losers need to get that straight in your twisted heads.

"Aloha also means goodbye. Aloha!"

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

Of course this has absolutely nothing remotely to do with the TMT.

I think gypsy was trying to make a connection between the technology of of the TMT and the technology based in Pearl Harbor prior to WWII, which would make Mauna Kea a target in wartime.

I don't believe that's true, nor do I think the Japanese would have stopped at a single attack on Pearl Harbor if the first had been even more successful. But getting back to Mauna Kea, let's jut say I don't believe observatories are often the primary target for invading enemy forces.

"How we spend our days is, of course, how we spend our lives." -Annie Dillard

[VancouverIslander]

There have been a lot of speculative 'what if' statements in the last dozen or so posts in this thread that are nothing but a distraction from the real questions. China is not going to use the TMT for military purposes, it's a massive waste of resources. You can track satellites with much cheaper gear (look, some of them are visible to unaugmented vision at night). The benefit for Hawaii comes from the many construction jobs, the numerous jobs that don't require a PhD, the enrichment to human knowledge that can be shared in any school, the increased exposure to the world to create tourism and more. This kind of project bring great guys like Tom here to raise the level of discussion on PW and I'm sure he buys local while he's here. Stop looking for as many handouts as you can get and realize that it's a great project for humanity and already has decent benefits to the community. Are we so dumb and poor that we can't earn scholarships or save money to get our kids through University? I worked a year for every year of University I paid for. My tenant works two jobs to pay for school.

And as far as military targets, Mauna Kea is way down the list. Military targets first, industrial targets second. Scientific targets are probably about 10th. If I had time to contact my uncle he could give me a detailed answer as he spent the end of his career at air command in Ottawa and was familiar with the priority of strategic targets. Where I lived at the time was a secondary target (near a Canadian air base - the closest primary target was Puget Sound for it's naval base) Pohakuloa would be a higher priority than Mauna Kea due to Bradshaw, but even that would be a low priority military target.

Just call me Mike

[PunaMauka2]

An actual invasion of Hawaii was never a serious objective, it was about crippling US naval capabilities, preferably to be destroyed in a long sought but elusive single stroke of glorious victory in battle, destroying the US fleet, paving the way for a negotiated peace favorable to Japan. This was the primary goal for the Japanese in initiating the battle of Midway. There were some who advocated for an invasion and occupation of Hawaii after the expected victory at Midway, but it appears Japanese high command didn't take this idea all that seriously or as much of a priority. Of course the plan to lure out and then destroy the bulk of US naval power during the battle of Midway didn't materialize, quite the contrary. So we can throw a bone to HOTPE and go ahead and say, yeah, theoretically it was a possibility in the woulda-coulda-shoulda of alternate historical fiction.


Back to TMT yet?

[kalakoa]

At this point, it really is up to TMT Corp. to sell their product.

TMT already offered money, jobs, and prestige; TMT participated in all process dictated by State. What more should TMT do, here?

TMT might be too big for Hawaii.

Oahu's rail project will cost as much as 4 TMTs. Should it not be built either?

[kalakoa]

At this point, it really is up to TMT Corp. to sell their product.

Forgot one:

DLNR has yet to hire the hearings officer who will preside over any future TMT permit consideration. Who should TMT be "selling" to?