why do we live(or come)here?

[BobH]

Hey Island Living, I'm on the outside looking in and what I am seeing and sensing is troublesome to me. My wife and I want to live in Hawaii and have been trying our best to accomplish that goal for the past 4 years by her being able to obtain a teaching position. I have been a member of Konaweb and Punaweb.

We travel to different islands when we can but have selected the Bi because of Real estate Prices. But I gotta tell you. Every time we go to Hawaii, on our way home we ask ourselves this question, “why live in Hawaii?’ Then we talk about the insults we get over at makaha from the people who claim to be Hawaiian, Two years ago while resting in the park at Hilo waiting for a redeye flight out, we had a young “Hawaiian come up to us and tell us we were sitting in his favorite spot and that his family was on their way for a picnic and didn’t invite us to move, told us to move.

There is an attitude in this forum on almost every issue. It’s like everyone is pissed off at everyone for everything. Aloha is a myth as far as I am concerned. And, it doesn’t matter how nice you try to be to others or how hard you try, being white in Hawaii is a struggle. I have made posts to other threads here at punaweb and in every case people come at ya….mad you’re here, made you opened your mouth, just plain made and glad to have someone to take it out on. It’s the same over at konaweb. I left that forum because of it. I’ll probably leave this one too because of it.

The problem is there are some really good people here; people, who care about others, really listen to what you are saying or asking and take time to reply. But the overall tone is just plain anger, I guess.

The funny thing about the BI, here again looking in from the outside is this: The BI has a huge problem with racism, hatred and anger and it has nothing to do with the economy, it has nothing to do with people out of work more now than before. I cannot explain but assume I will have my head tromped as soon as I push the “Post New reply” Button.

IslandLiving: The only thing I can tell you is this: If a place like the BI draws malcontents from around the world because of a perceived chance for a new life, pretty soon all you have is malcontents. The funny thing is that it happens in Aspen too. The billionaires are moving the millionaires out and the millionaires are pissed. Funny, it was only 20 years ago that the average people were being relocated by the millionaires.

My wife and I have got nothing really. Only our integrity and a wish to be near our family in Asia and to have a simple life in a climate that meets our needs. What we don’t need is a bunch of people who think because they came first that they are entitled to IT. The earth belongs to God and everyone on it are simply guests!

Best of success to all you do and good luck!

BobH


Best!
BobH

[freestate]

I have to say islandlvng did kind of charge in with full head of steam but I appreciate his point of view. However one thing I have noticed about Punaweb is that the contributors for the most part are pretty civil. And although she doesn't need me to defend her KathyH seems to be one of the most even tempered and moderate folks on the board.

I'm going to jump in even though I'm 41. I consider myself pretty objective (yeah, everyone does) since I didn't move here thinking it was a paradise just a new environment. Also I'm not caucasian and grew up in the middle of the US in a very small town. I just want to post what I've found most surprising about the Big Island since I didn't come here with expectations of perfection.

Now my perspective is from someone that moved here because my partner had a great opportunity for her post-doc. I've been able to find a way to make things work for myself no matter where I've lived so we decided to see what Hawaii was like for a few years. We moved in summer '08, as in right before the economy tanked big-time. I work in the trades (cabinetmaker) so that has not been great.

On the BI we've lived in HPP, North Hilo, and we just moved to just outside of Waimea (greenside).

I've not posted much because I'm new so little familiarity with local politics so don't feel like I have a lot to contribute. But since this deals with how folks feel about East Hawaii I do have some thoughts.

I have to say I agree with a lot of what islandlvng has to say about East Hawaii but don't go out of my way to tell people all the things I don't like about their home.

But what has surprised me something Rob mentioned in another thread. That Hawaii is about thirty years behind the mainland. I see this in the acceptance of things like dumping trash, kids riding in the back of pickups, cruelty to animals, and open expressions of prejudice. The attitude that white people are like this, Japanese like that, Micronesians, Portuguese, etc. These are things I saw as a child in the seventies and are no longer accepted even in the middle of Kansas. To be clear, I'm not saying these attitudes no longer exist; I'm addressing their acceptance by the local culture.

Another thing that really surprised me was the undercurrent of hostility to mainlanders, I thought we were all Americans but it seems there are a lot here that have disdain for the continetal US. Twice in Hilo I had incidents of locals yelling haole insults at me, once at a stoplight and once in a parking lot. Strange because I'm not white but I am obviously not local. This to me relates to the "aloha" spirit and how little of it I've experienced from locals. The friendliest people we've met here are people that weren't born in Hawaii. To me "Midwest nice" trumps "aloha" but thats just been my experience, if you are from less friendly parts of the country you might feel differently.

I understand there are lots of historical issues under the surface but feel like there is trouble brewing. Hopefully there will be some equilibrium in the future but to me I think the "Hawaii for Hawaiians" might be tipping too far. I know it was necessary at one time but there is always a danger when you fight to be proud of "your people" because it can easily slip into racism. I think clan mentality is human nature but something to be overcome, not celebrated.

It seems like a side affect of this resentment is the wholesale rejection of "mainland" ways. To me its crazy to be part of one of the most wealthy nations on the planet and not take advantage. A lot of things work better on the mainland (quality of local medical care an example), but I've been told never start any sentence, "back in **** they would..." Reminds me so much of living in a small town and not doing things "the way they do in the city". Cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Frequently the local response mentions something about crime, traffic, pollution on the mainland. As if your choice is Hawaii or Detroit, D.C. and Southcentral L.A.

Look I know this sounds like I don't see anything positive about Hawaii but its not the case. The Big Island does have some great scenery, some places are so beautiful that they seem computer generated. And although we don't live in East Hawaii any longer I have to say the climate up here in Waimea is fantastic. Feels like a perfect Spring day, every day.

I should also say Punaweb has been a great insight into local vibe. I think its been a great resource and think Rob does a great thing providing this for the community. I'm still hopeful that Hawaii will be hard to leave when the time comes. I also fully understand that different localities are a better fit for different individuals.

[missydog1]

Why live or come here.
That is a central question about why we live our lives the way we do.
For me - while I am not a new age philosopher - I do believe I have a path in life. I want to live somewhere that my path has brought me to. I try to pay attention when that stage of the path has ended and it's time to move on. I cannot pick my path by doing the equivalent of throwing a dart at a map. I need a reason to go somewhere.

So many aspects of my life came together to point me at Hawai'i, that I had to come here. Whether I am supposed to stay here is an open question, but I know I had to come, that I had lessons to learn here.

[Devany]

Island Living, personally, I think that some people are not cut out to live in parts of the big island and some are not a fit on the island as a whole. You are correct about the crime and trash in many places, as well as unruly or unfriendly people in certain areas, but the island as a whole is not like that. Either you are part of the problem or you are part of the solution. It clearly is time for you to move on. I have heard it said and I truly believe it, either the island embraces you or it repels you, there is no middle of the road. You are young and need a good job ... so go to the mainland where unemployment is higher than here. Or go to California, a state where property taxes and utility costs will bankrupt you and the state government is in financial ruin. Know what? The whole nation is in the crapper since ten years ago. Don't your read the news?

I certainly do nor meet your age criteria, I have been on this planet for 55 years but I have a son who is 32 who just spent 6 weeks here totally enjoying every moment of every day (and a lot of it in {Puna) without a single complaint. Unfortunately, he needs to live on the mainland for his career. Maybe you do too.

Aloha~ in this case that means good bye. We can all learn from the feelings you have expressed and try to make this place better, or of course we can just leave too. Not me. My roots have already dug in.

Aloha au i Hawai`i,
devany

www.myhawaiianhome.blogspot.com
www.eastbaypotters.blogspot.com

[islandlvng]

If i've taken a class, (I need to take it again.) ( I need a good job.) I guess a manager isnt a good job. Hey, what else do I need? You know, for years i've heard locals talk down on "haoles" for always telling them what THEY need. Thanks for living up to that one. And comparing Hawaii to California? Why does Cali keep being brought up? How many states do we have? And why are they all failing? Please enlighten me and everyone else by backing that claim up. All of the mainland has a higher unemployment rate than us? Furlough friday what???? School system what??? What news are you reading? Oh, the Tribune. Enough said. Your information is way off and need to get the true facts straight. Back up the things you said statistically Devany about all of the mainland. Utility costs, only comparing California? no no. Helco wants to raise rates 7%. I pay 140 a month!!! During summer with no ac! Wasnt there a topic on here about how fraudulent Helco was awhile back? Hmmmmm. And last i checked, there was still quite a few people in California that werent bankrupt. But hey what do i know. Im only 30 who needs a better education, need to travel, need to get a better job...... Lot of people who have it all figured out in here. And in Puna of all places. Thanks for the entertainment. Its funny, everyone has the answer to everything, yet, two people actually answered my question. Ha!

[ric]

Is something bothering you, islandlvng?

[kani-lehua]

hmm? i counted at least 8 of us giving various reasons (some are vague and not entirely clear) for living/coming here:

808blogger: refer to his/her first post, item #1

glen: first post, items 1-20

rob tucker: "...because we have the freedom to do so..."

csgray: "...someplace with a steady supply of vitamin d, natural beauty..."

kathyh: "...so many aspects of my life came together to point me at hawai'i..."

kani-lehua: "...better than living on o'ahu..."

freestate: "...my partner had a great opportunity..."

stillhope: "...the only one affordable place...the nice climate..."


disagree. "...everyone has the answer to everything..."



"a great many people think they are thinking when they are merely rearranging their prejudices."

w. james

[Greg]

I grew up all over the country. My dad was in medical equipment sales with GE and kept getting new territory.

The first major move I was deeply affected by was from SoCal to Milwaukee when I was starting high school. I had my first surfboard and girlfriend. What I realized with that move was that kids have fun wherever they are. I had a blast in Wisconsin. Two years later, Charlotte. Had a blast! Denver, Brookfield, Boone, Vietnam (blast was literal), New Orleans, San Pedro, DC, San Luis Obispo, Tallahassee, Avalon; Had a blast.

All of these places had the bad along with the good; But none of them had Left Point, Drainpipes, Second Bay, Bowls, Makalawena, or 69's. None of them had 80 degree water.

I've been here twenty three years and have a goal of getting in the water at least twice a week. I'm not going anywhere. I've never had a bad experience with racism, but didn't on the mainland either. Sure things have changed, but the rest of the world isn't as pristine as it once was either.

I really wish you the best, but I'm not confident that you're going to be any happier anywhere else. Only you can determine the quality of life you enjoy.

Good Luck!

Stoneface

[Dave M]

islandlvng,

Yeah dude you seem to have a real chip on your shoulder. Maybe(speculation) you have made up your mind to leave and are trying to justfy it on an internet forum.. hell I don't know but come check out Austin TX. Many people from Hawaii seem to like it here..(note: you're ganna need a real coat).

It seems like everbody here is being pretty civil to you in as much as the gist of the messages are simply saying we/they agree with your complaints, but maybe the island isn't for you anymore...On the other hand you seem to be biting evryone's head off and reading all kinda sht into their posts.

I'm sorry but you're kinda being an ahole and well quite frankly, that my job! [] Lighten up dude you're 30.. opps now the gig is up.. The problem is you see a priceless French painting and I see a picture of a naked drunk girl.. Safe travels!



Blessings,
dave

"It doesn't mean that much to me.. to mean that much to you." Neil Young

[islandlvng]

other than people who dont have their facts correct, employment being one of the few, this has been quite entertaining. What an overwhelming response due a simple question. People getting offended, telling me what i need to do with myself, as if i've been going down the wrong path thus far. God, i'd hate to see the response id get if i started sharing my differences with Fords. What, would you punaweb'rs start crying and hold a public hanging? Me bothered? Read the opening question I made once more carefully and without objection and the responses after by others. It was simple QUESTION! Ask them whats bothering them. LOL All this for having very real concerns with the future and the way things are going here. Especially agriculture which im a big part of. No one else bothered huh? Not according to recent topics that were discussed in this very website..... I can say with 100% fullness that had we all been sitting down face to face, half of these things would have never been said to me. When I talk about this with other members of my community, neighbors and such, NO ONE gets offended or pissy. In fact, ive always been agreed with on these issues, but funny, here everyone feels threatend. And the fingers start going. LOL And thats why there is the internet. Sorry for stepping on a Punawebrs toes. The wolfpack came in for the kill. HA HA Nobody calls out the ones who post incorrect statistics and makes unfounded claims about someones history who theyve ever met? and this is an older crowd? Way to look at it from all angles, very punaweb ish ehhhhh lol.