Sign waving Rally at Hilo Air. Tues. 9-19 3-5pm

[MarkD]

We go from a discussion on what type of rules we should have on helicopter tours to a suggestion to ban all tourists. What profound thinking.

[PaulW]

It's a debating technique used to expose faulty logic. It has a Latin name which I won't mention, that's way too elitist.

How did the sign waving go? Did anyone there mention where one has to go to experience 60 helicopters a day or does that remain an unsolvable mystery?

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

Digression is one of the the easiest ways to divert a topic
...
What profound thinking.

Yes.
Almost like taking a discussion about rat lungworm into the weeds, by claiming organic farming methods encourage rat habitats, that the statement is supported by a reference in an unsubstantiated opinion piece (without scientific or statistical documentation), because it can be considered "common sense" and it was in a newspaper (of public record?), although, again, not in the news section but on the editorial page.

Like that?

The Donner Party really wasn't that great of a party, was it?

[kalakoa]

People want the benefits of tourism (lower taxes) but not the downsides (a bit more traffic, a little more noise).

The reality is: taxes are going up anyway. Prices, too, because retailers pass their tax burden along to the customer.

I would like to see an honest accounting of the tourism revenue so that I can better understand the implied value proposition.

Simply put: how much "benefit" are we seeing when the tour operators enjoy tax exemptions and the State keeps most of the (suddenly higher) TAT to build rail?

[Obie]

Benefits of Hawai‘i’s Tourism Economy
Tourism is the largest single source of private capital into Hawai‘i economy and a significant export
Tourism contributed to $1.5 billion in total state tax revenue in 2013, an incremental $30 million
year over year.
For every $1,000,000 in direct visitor expenditures, tourism supports 11.2 jobs, according to the U.S.
Chamber of Commerce.
Tourism is the biggest generator of jobs among the major economic sectors, supporting 168,000
jobs in Hawai‘i in 2013.
Honolulu is ranked as the 4th busiest international port of entry for the U.S., according to the U.S.
Department of Commerce.
The TAT is currently held at 9.25%. In FY2013, the state collected $368.5 million in transient
accommodations tax (TAT).
The HTA estimates that the TAT will generate $403 million in 2014.
There are 920 flights from 52 cities

[kalakoa]

Tourism is the largest single source of private capital

No matter where that money goes, it's safe to assume the helicopters won't be regulated.

[glinda]

People want the benefits of tourism (lower taxes) but not the downsides (a bit more traffic, a little more noise).

A "bit" more to some is 12 instead of 11, or some such 'additional' something or other. Whereas with the helicopters, in many instances it's not a bit more but rather the difference between no noise at all and noise. With as many as 10 - 12, and at other times, 20 - 24 helicopter flights a day that's not a "bit". But hey, some people accept noise as a part of their lives, have never figure out that there is something to be gained by listening to the silence. To the sounds of nature. To so many of the things that makes Puna, and living in a rural setting so rewarding. And god knows they lack the empathy needed to understand the difference. They just expect that we all live the same way they do.

[PaulW]

I think I appreciate silence more than most people, but that doesn't mean I get to stop cars from driving down my street.
What you want doesn't trump what everybody else wants, or economic realities.

[leilanidude]

there is something to be gained by listening to the silence. To the sounds of nature.
------
Coqui next to your window, at night. Such a sweet noise.

[MarkD]

that doesn't mean I get to stop cars from driving down my street.

Comparing cars to helicopters didn't work the first time you tried to link the two, and it doesn't work now.