Ouch that still burns a bit Hotpe. LOL.
I can always try my best to further explain my many opinions about this issue, on this forum.
Those in that group with Mr, Ha on our peaceful and calm mountain that day, should be apologizing to everyone including you, for the way they represented our communities or handled the early communication stages of the TMT project. Heart felt pain replaced hard earned Trust that day, jmo.
For decades now, That group on the mountain negotiating that day has been running this good ole boy show. Controlling our resources and priorities, representing our voiceless oppressed, while always having their voices matter most at the end. That's why you see the same guys thinking or standing on the same side of most important issues, whether it be G.M.O, Geothermal, transportation, TMT, or the newest endeavors like MMJ. "If" they lose their way or find themselves outnumbered they simply change the interpretations of the rules or laws, to make sure the insensitive development and oppression of the majority continues. Jmo
We have gotten led by this group of replacement scientists for a long time now, it may be time to move in a different direction. This island is full of resources that may need to be protected for future generations beyond our own. The summit of Mauna Kea is one of those important irreplaceable resources, as is the aloha spirit and culture of the native Hawaiians.
Just maybe The TMT and astronomy community shouldn't be allowed to buy, develop, and control Mauna Kea's summit or many other valuable resources for the next 70 years, especially for 1.4 billion promises. Jmo.
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quote:
Originally posted by gypsy69
Ouch that still burns a bit Hotpe. LOL.
I can always try my best to further explain my many opinions about this issue, on this forum.
Those in that group with Mr, Ha on our peaceful and calm mountain that day, should be apologizing to everyone including you, for the way they represented our communities or handled the early communication stages of the TMT project. Heart felt pain replaced hard earned Trust that day, jmo.
For decades now, That group on the mountain negotiating that day has been running this good ole boy show. Controlling our resources and priorities, representing our voiceless oppressed, while always having their voices matter most at the end. That's why you see the same guys thinking or standing on the same side of most important issues, whether it be G.M.O, Geothermal, transportation, TMT, or the newest endeavors like MMJ. "If" they lose their way or find themselves outnumbered they simply change the interpretations of the rules or laws, to make sure the insensitive development and oppression of the majority continues. Jmo
We have gotten led by this group of replacement scientists for a long time now, it may be time to move in a different direction. This island is full of resources that may need to be protected for future generations beyond our own. The summit of Mauna Kea is one of those important irreplaceable resources, as is the aloha spirit and culture of the native Hawaiians.
Just maybe The TMT and astronomy community shouldn't be allowed to buy, develop, and control Mauna Kea's summit or many other valuable resources for the next 70 years, especially for 1.4 billion promises. Jmo.
Aloha ahiahi, gypsy. I get what you are saying, so in essence, you do support "native Hawaiians" (ie. kanaka maoli, etc.) managing our own resources.
With this statement, as I understand your post, we should be able to protect and utilize our land and resources to benefit all people, in all communities of Hawai'i (Moku o Keawe, and all other islands). I agree, to include, Mauna Kea, Pohakuloa, Volcano National Park, and geothermal development (and all mineral rights held in trust), among other resources and land we own (the public; ALL of us).
EO! (If that is the gist of your comment. I still hold Mr. Ha in high regard, and have great respect for him, for the record.)
JMO.
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Sometimes it's very hard to reconcile arguments those against the TMT make, especially when it comes to Richard Ha:
dakine wrote in
http://www.punaweb.org/Forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=22430
" Read the article (linked above) HOTPE, it's pretty clear that Richard is a (very) late comer to the party and has no direct kuleana in the proceedings."
Now, Gypsy states in this thread:
" Richard Ha also says in this video that he first met with the TMT Bossman 10 years ago or more and that he could tell right away he would want to do business with this type of person. So Richard Ha has already been having his voice heard for over 10 years regarding this TMT project being here in Hawaii"
Between a rock and a hard place comes to mind.
Opihikao, good evening to you and Hope all is well.
Always impressed with the way you can read between my jibberish lines and listen as well as you hear.
I do not condone the misleading or selling of the general public short over important community issues and resources like the TMT project or Geothermal development.
good example, The Geothermal monopoly here acts or postures like the geothermal industry now has the best or safest technology that would allow them to drill anywhere in Hawaii and produce a profit from this energy resource. It might Make some of us feel like we need this giant green clean neighbor of geothermal and wouldn't want them to pack up and move elsewhere. Puna in my opinion, is the only destination for any profitable geothermal industry in Hawaii (period), much like the TMT project "NEEDING MAUNA KEA", and they have known it for decades.
If drilling for steam is like digging for gold a couple hundred years ago. You can strike gold (steam) in lower puna 7 out of 10 times. Quality Gold (quality steam) would only be struck 3 times or less out of ten on maui, Oahu, or Kona's west side, it's a red herring only. Plus the cost would be considerably more each time they strike out and missed their drill for quality gold.
large amounts of Water and the lava chambers hot spot are conveniently both located under lower Puna. The great folks of Puna have put up or sacrificed their way of life for decades so this type of exploratory enhanced geothermal drilling and development may one day lead to a better tomorrow. I would like to see how the Hualalai or Haleakala communities would put up with these expanding geothermal operations. Or what kind of infrastructure costs would have to be included to make this resource as profitable as they have it currently in Puna. jmo.
Also this improved enhanced geothermal resource is being taken and sold today for yesterday's fixed prices, rather than at a fair market value. This resource should be protected from this point forward until we have proper management and oversight to allow All including the coming generations to benefit.
Apologize Opihikao, for the extended rant. Much respect to you and your Ohana.
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Gypsy - this is a thread about the TMT in case you hadn't noticed, not geothermal energy. Although I think it's unlikely, people might just have a bit more respect for you if you didn't continually hijack threads with your geothermal-based rants.
Tomk, good evening and point taken. I have learned from the master himself on how to make every thread my personal thread.
TomK, you might think That the geothermal is not related in any way to the TMT project and that's your prerogative. I myself see many similarities throughout the state wanted Projects.
For example, Much of the same group siding with the TMT project today is the same group I watched push for the expansion of Geothermal in my backyard this past decade or two. If the Observatories including the TMT project need consistant Electricity to do their many searches and Discoveries, then they may need Geothermal energy from Puna in the future?
TomK, you have over 25 years of experience dealing with folks like myself "so called trolls under the bridge" on the internet you created. Please once again, try and add substance rather than these continued personal integrity attacks.
You know you have done the same hijacking to others including myself in the past. In the past You have claimed you will make comments on space, observatory, or astronomy subjects only as to not offend others. Then shortly later you jump down Dakine's or my back on our unrelated threads that have nothing to do with your unquestioned expertise.
You never had to be so rude to me on my first few threads on my first rodeo forum, you chose to be. I reacted, and you got a good rise from it. Now you will simply claim you remember nothing of the sorts rather than apologize for your instigating intentions. My apologies to you for "wanting, not threatening" to kick your foreign ass off the mountain until other important issues were resolved were sincere at the time.
I know your intentions are good or pure TomK, you probably think you and your colleagues have done nothing wrong. Sorry I don't see it that way and would rather the Summit of Mauna Kea be restored, respected, and protected for future generations.
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"Sorry I don't see it that way and would rather the Summit of Mauna Kea be restored, respected, and protected for future generations."
Aren't you the guy who wanted to build a ski resort there? When are you moving back to the mainland again?
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"Much of the same group siding with the TMT project today is the same group I watched push for the expansion of Geothermal in my backyard this past decade or two"
Name them.
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If I disliked a forum as much as you seem to, I would start my own.
Now what was that about Richard Ha being late to the party? Do you stand by that statement?
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Update - FYI: Contested Case Hearing Status
Document dated July 12, 2016 - To Judge Amano requesting continuance (from Richard Naiwi Wurderman for Witness Preparation, etc.):
https://dlnr.hawaii.gov/wp-content/uploa...Doc-83.pdf
Supported by the Hawaiian Kingdom, Ali'i Sir Kaikolehua Kanaele (Adds in the request to join the motion regarding ownership of the land):
https://dlnr.hawaii.gov/wp-content/uploa...DOC-88.pdf
TMT Response to Request for Continuance - Dated July 14, 2016:
https://dlnr.hawaii.gov/wp-content/uploa...DOC-85.pdf
UH Response in Opposition to Request for Continuance:
https://dlnr.hawaii.gov/wp-content/uploa...DOC-86.pdf
Wuderman's Response to TMT/UH Opposition - Dated July 14, 2016:
https://dlnr.hawaii.gov/wp-content/uploa...DOC-87.pdf
The above is the most important filings, however, many other motions are available at this link:
http://dlnr.hawaii.gov/faqs/mauna-kea-faq/
Keep in mind, there are over 150 witnesses between all parties. Judge Amano estimated the entire Contested Case Hearing would take approximately three (3) weeks. That may be a very tall order.
JMO.
ETA: Typo, sorry.
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