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Big Island *takes first step* in banning GMO's
Richard,
You quote Darwin's book title, while igoring the key word:
"The Origin of Species
By Means of Natural Selection..."
Natural selection refers to variation within species, as nature intended. Darwin would be as pissed about your misuse of his words and science as Hector or myself when you twist our words.
Rob - I am disappointed and shocked at your casual dismissal of one of the biggest issues of our time: "The anti vaccination crowd has found a new bogeyman." You can be pro-GMO if you wish, but this comment shows a cynical disregard that is very sad from someone as intelligent as yourself. Do you think 60 nations that regulate GMOs are also victims of hysteria?


Russell
Russell
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I'm sorry you disagree Russell but I do respect that you have a different opinion. I do not fault you for not agreeing with me. I find a distinct difference between the science of genetically modified organisms and the business model of the Monsantos. The science has a lot to offer us as a world population. The salvation of our papaya industry is due to GMO science. I do not reject the science. I would suggest that you yourself would hurry down to the hospital if faced with a deadly disease and there was a genetically modified process or procedure that could save you. I would.

As for the business model, that is another matter and one not solved by any of the current legislation I have seen proposed.

Like many advances in science there are results that are considered beneficial and some that are considered not beneficial. There are positive and negative aspects to everything. I favor those things which I perceive to have more positives than negatives.

Banning GMO off hand is throwing the baby out with the bath water. More thinking needs to go into the legislation before I could support it. I am opposed. As for the "60 nations" thing.... you may not have noticed but I do not run with a herd. I am however fully in favor of labeling.

Assume the best and ask questions.

Punaweb moderator
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quote:
Originally posted by Greg

Diversified agriculture to compliment the visitor industry?

Excellent idea; except we don't need GMO, which tends to develop mono crops and profits large agribusiness rather than small farms.


It only seems that way if you believe the anti-science activists' propaganda and ignore most of the real world evidence.

Simply look at the success of the GMO papaya story for a resounding rebuttal. It's almost entirely a small farms story. One researcher, one assistant, a small grant, a collapsed industry with no big bucks behind it. Family farms on the brink of disaster. A small, brilliant adjustment to a snip of genetic code, out of millions, which allows the fruit to activate its own natural immune system. Says Dr. Gonsalves, "It was a papaya before, it's a papaya after." Problem solved, family farms saved, delicious fruit on my breakfast table.

Radical activists have directed much, much more attention to this situation than it actually deserves. They've tied it to Monsanto, when Monsanto was not involved. They've tried to tie it to pesticide use, when the pesticides in use had nothing to do with GMOs, and were already in use before the GMO varieties were developed. And 15 years after introduction there is no credible evidence that ANY problem has resulted, and even the famously scrupulous Japanese approval process has certified them as safe for import and consumption without limits.

So why is a tiny handful of radicals continuing to dominate the public discourse on this? Seriously?

Multiply this humble project by a factor of a thousand and you'll get a truer sense of what GMO technology is capable of, and what it is in fact doing around the world. Lots and lots and lots of small, independent transgenic projects are addressing an unbelievably broad range of scientific intentions.

Let's use it to eradicate malaria, definitely. And Dengue fever. And while we're at it let's use it to save at least some of the 600,000 children a year who die or go blind from chronic dietary Vitamin A deficiency, when a humanitarian project to add the vital nutrient to their normal daily ration of rice has already been developed and is ready for deployment by non-profit organizations. The only thing holding them back, for 6 years now (let's see, 600,000 children X 6 is how many?), is irrational resistance by emotional anti-science activists.

I just saw another small but potentially very useful project documented on PBS, a researcher who is using GMOs to transform unassuming small green houseplants into sophisticated detectors for explosives, toxic elements, and biological agents. And once perfected, you'll be able to grow them at will, anywhere in the world, from a package of seeds. Maybe they could someday be used to detect cancer? Or Vitamin B12 deficiencies?

Go hate on Monsanto all you want, with my blessings, because I do think they are a horribly irresponsible corporation. But stop conflating Monsanto with GMO technology, which they neither created, nor do they own, or even control. The key patents they bought from the USDA 20 years ago have already expired, so the genie is now REALLY out of the bottle. Anybody who wants to can now work in this arena with no connection to Monsanto whatsoever.

quote:
Energy security?

[i]Not exactly improving. Although Geothermal and solar help reduce our dependence on oil; Any energy resource that feeds HELCO's archaic grid distribution system only reinforces their monopolistic stranglehold on Hawaii consumers.

Peeling away the rhetoric, 40% renewable energy sourcing on the way to 50% in two years is DEFINITELY improving. It's actually one of the best performances by a public utility in the world.

I don't see "monopolistic" as necessarily being a bad thing, when that monopoly is not only overseen but blessed by the government in order to foster a stable utility service, which requires very long range investment and maintenance, with shareholder ROI determined by a PUC.

Yes, yes, the entire structure needs revision as technology overtakes the former paradigm, but what doesn't?

quote:
Then there's the added liability of HELCO's monthly outages that affect thousands at a time.

As opposed to, say, recent internet outages that have affected hundreds of millions at a time? Over the last few years I've personally found the latter to be more disruptive than the former. And I can only WISH my cellphone was as reliable as HELCO.

quote:
Investigate the emerging fuel cell technology (Bloom energy box), combined with micro grids. The future is closer than people think.

I'm all for it. For example, anyone can now build their own EV out of a serviceable shell of a dead ICE production car, using off-the-shelf electric motor and fuel cell components. Add your own solar powered hydrogen fuel production from water and I think you'll have achieved real independence!

But, there will always be people who don't want to be bothered with all that, and people who look for the most stable, least controversial solution, and so I'm sure the Public Utility for Electricity will still be a widespread feature of my grandchildren's lifetimes.

Beating up on HELCO is, I think, a waste of time. It never seems to accomplish much, and it seems to just divert attention from simply bringing a new future into existence, which will in turn, according to all that History has to teach us, force change on HELCO and the government. It's always been thus, and it always will be. The old persists until a clearly superior future presents itself.

Namaste, y'all. And aloha!
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No need to beat up on HELCO. Unless they change their business model they will collapse upon themselves.

While they fiercely resist the concept of micro grids, more and more people continue to unhook as the new technologies become more available and affordable. This increases the burden of remaining customers and the cycle continues. Why isn't HELCO promoting newer, more efficient, and safer ways to deliver power?

Feeding alternative energy into the existing grid is like driving a brand new car 100mph on cracked threadbare tires. In fact, one of HELCO's biggest challenges today is balancing the power grid as more people feed into it. At some point people are going to ask; "Why do we even need it? It's 150 year old technology".

Fifty one megawatt power stations are more reliable and secure than one fifty megawatt station (especially in Lava Zone 1). People have trouble getting homeowners insurance 1/4 mile from the Geothermal plant. Is this really the best option to place our entire energy future?

HELCO's is a failed model; they just don't realize it yet. Instead of leading us into the 21st century, they are choosing to sail blindly into an iceberg while struggling to hang on to what they have. The welfare of the consumer has never been a priority of theirs; but their profits are enormous (until they aren't).
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Strange twisted irony: there's no net metering, and HELCO's big argument against grid-tie PV is "capacity planning problem".

Simple solution: if the grid-tie PV were configured to NEVER backfeed the grid, the net effect turns into a straight load reduction, no impact to the grid other than lowering the peak load, so no objections from HELCO, right?
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Another excellent mini-essay by OpenD! I sent one more email to Zendo Kern against Bill 113 with a link to the previous post and urged him to read it. CC'd the mayor who may be the last defense against the bill.
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Wrong. Peak load occurs at 6 am and 7 pm, so the impact to the grid would be fewer kwh sold but just as much kw capacity that HELCO must maintain.

I do not understand this senseless villification of HELCO. They sell a product. Imagine if you had a produce stand at which you sold stuff you had grown, but all your neighbors thought that they should get to sell their stuff at your stand and that furthermore their stuff should sell first, only buying your stuff if they absolutely ran out. You would get no income and would have to maintain the stand, plus keep growing just as much produce for those times when others couldn't supply themselves. That would clearly be ridiculous.

There is plenty about HELCO and more specifically US energy policy to complain about without making stuff up.
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Wow I leave for a couple day's and bang there's openD. Great stuff, truly captive with a needed positive view. Seems that your very pro- gmo, geo, helco, and the status quo that's been moving us forward here?. Why is it acceptable to have no toilets and fish kills in Kapoho? Why don't we grow more foods for these situations you brought up. That would be able to feed our community longer if these things happen?. If we are this vulnerable then it seems we should encourage less gmo papaya and more small citrus farms for example. And with all this Gmo farm land, how many Jobs for our legal community does this bring us? How many local residence work these Gmo fields and geothermal plant?. Is the pay as Good as longs, burger king or subway to work this land this way? I really don't know so please enlighten me. To bad Gmo can't claim something like they cured hunger for the islands rather than they saved Hawaii's Papaya industry. You truly did a great job of picking my written points apart with your reasoning. Have you ever seen that movie good will hunting? I felt very much like Robin Williams did, when you were done with me. I would love to hear some of your ideas too, not just acceptance of the status quo of moving forward. lol go easy.
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quote:
Originally posted by MarkP

Imagine if you had a produce stand at which you sold stuff you had grown, but all your neighbors thought that they should get to sell their stuff at your stand and that furthermore their stuff should sell first, only buying your stuff if they absolutely ran out. You would get no income and would have to maintain the stand, plus keep growing just as much produce for those times when others couldn't supply themselves. That would clearly be ridiculous.


Not really, MarkP.
Granted, "vilification" is way, way too often the mode on blogs -- and, IMHO, especially by those not using their own names.

Anyway, about that fruit stand:
The HELCO situation is more like if only the neighbor with the fruit stand was allowed to sell fruit; and, if you produce fruit, you are allowed to sell it only through them and then only if they choose to buy it after they have sold all of their own fruit.
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Not to get this too blown out of proportion but is anybody suggesting that they should be able to form a little grid and sell power to their neighbors? In my example I was assuming that individuals would be producing for themselves but still wanting the grid for back-up. If they want to sell to their neighbors then they will have to invest in power distribution infrastructure, like HELCO did. If anyone were to do so I have difficulty believing they would be OK with others selling power over their grid.

I produce my own power with no back-up from the grid. Granted I think it would be very wrong for the county or HELCO to somehow require you to hook-up or buy out of the deal, like making final inspection contingent on doing so.
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