Hawaiian DNA in soil atop Mauna Kea?

[leilanidude]

A quarry is apparently OK, too.

[MarkD]

Some of the above arguments seem a bit abstract for the layman (excuse me, layperson). I am fairly ignorant on the religious significance of Maunakea and will be happy to hear corrections/explanations from ohiagrrl (aloha to you) or anyone else. My simple observations and questions:

Sites of religious significance to peoples, native or otherwise, seem to fall on a continuum. At one end, hypothetically, would be Mt. Everest’s significance to native people of Nepal. The reverence for the mountain here, if there is such, would be abstract. No native people every walked up (before invention of modern climbing and cold weather gear); no practices conducted on site.

The religious value here, it seems, would be far less than places where people gather for religious or other practices or where personages like spiritual leaders or chiefs meet. Such sites for native Americans include:

* Weatherman Draw, south-central Montana, sacred to many tribes for its cliff paintings.

* Medicine Lake Highlands, northeastern California as a sanctuary and place of healing for 10,000 years.

Both sites are easily accessible. How many native Hawaiians climbed Maunakea pre-Captain Cook?

Seems quite the journey. At least 5-6 days from the coast? And everyone had to carry water in gourds. And food and other supplies. A difficult endeavor.

It seems the primary activity was the Maunakea Adz Quarry. Were there religious services/activities separate from this? Were the quarry workers commoners? (one would think) Or were the workers significant personages and quarrying considered a religious activity? (could be)

Burial Grave sites should always be given respect, with bones dealt with--if they are to be moved--with archeological procedures. But it seem that the value of bones must, in many instances, be regarded as of greater value than the burial site.

The reality of all cultures throughout history is that people were sometimes buried in the most convenient spot near their death, especially commoners. Deaths of quarry workers on Maunakea could be handled by 4 people carrying a litter and body down the mountain. Or it could be handled (more logically) by interring on the mountain, the most convenient spot.

This “convenient spot” generalization explains why, in so many places worldwide, the bones of just one or two people turn up at construction sites. Given the many stresses of civilization, urgent matters like seeking food, work obligations, strife, weather calamities, the deceased--and often the unexpectedly deceased (e.g., accidental fall on Maunakea)--were frequently buried in the nearest place that a hole could be dug. And any treasured personal items placed on top of the body. An informal burial.

In contrast are cemeteries, burial sites of royal or religious personages (e.g., tombs), or any other places where burial was formalized. These sites obviously are sacred to the involved peoples or kin. A particular of these sites is that people remember and honor the sites through cultural memories and story telling through generations.

Is the argument being advanced that any finding of human remains on Maunakea, regardless of circumstance, denotes a sacred site?

Is there physical evidence that there are burial sites of unique or special nature, e.g., royal and spiritual personages?

Should the whole mountain top be off limits or just the specific burial site? (and by what site perimeter?) Just asking.

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

Should the whole mountain top be off limits or just the specific burial site? (and by what site perimeter?) Just asking

Some have even suggested the presence of DNA fragments are enough to designate an area a burial ground.

If I know what I shall find, I do not want to find it. Uncertainty is the salt of life. - biochemist Erwin Chargaff

[opihikao]

quote:

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Originally posted by HereOnThePrimalEdge

graffiti on Mauna Kea rocks.

It's hard to imagine after everything that's occurred on Mauna Kea in the last two years, with all that's been said, that anyone on this island would come up with the big idea to tag boulders on the mountaintop, buy cans of spray paint at the hardware store, drive up Saddle Road for an hour, get out of their car & look around them at Mauna Kea and all the world that surrounds them on high -- and after all that still think they had an idea worth carrying out to completion.

If I know what I shall find, I do not want to find it. Uncertainty is the salt of life. - biochemist Erwin Chargaff

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Update on the graffiti, FYI:


CITIZEN TIPS AND ASSISTANCE LEAD TO SUSPECT IN MAUNA KEA GRAFFITI CASE

Hawai‘i Island Woman Issued Criminal Citation

(Hilo) - Assistance provided by the Native Hawaiian community allowed officers from the Hawai‘i Branch of the DLNR Division of Conservation and Resources Enforcement (DOCARE) to make contact with a suspect in the recent case of graffiti damage found at the Mauna Kea Ice Age Natural Area Reserve (NAR).

As a result of this contact and investigation, Hope Cermelj of Kalapana, Hawai‘i was issued a citation for violating Rule 13-209-4 (3), Prohibited Activities within a Natural Area Reserve. Cermelj will be required to appear in Hilo District Court.

Graffiti was discovered on several rocks in the NAR on April 28th, as well as on structures belonging to the Office of Mauna Kea Management.

DLNR/DOCARE thanks community members who stepped forward to provide information and assistance. This was instrumental in locating and identifying the suspect.

Andrew Pereira, KITV NEWS

ETA: Apologies for the O/T.

[kalakoa]

Rule 13-209-4 (3), Prohibited Activities within a Natural Area Reserve

Isn't that the same rule that wasn't used to prosecute the "protectors" after they set up camp?

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

Thanks opihikao.
Here's the offenders Facebook page:
https://www.facebook.com/hope.cermelj

If I know what I shall find, I do not want to find it. Uncertainty is the salt of life. - biochemist Erwin Chargaff

[leilanidude]

Is the argument being advanced that any finding of human remains on Maunakea, regardless of circumstance, denotes a sacred site?
------------------------------

I have stated the belief many times, that the ancients, having killed many of their own, all over the island, either left to rot or buried people, everywhere. This has resulted in every discovery of a bone, being called a burial site.

[opihikao]

quote:

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Originally posted by HereOnThePrimalEdge

Thanks opihikao.
Here's the offenders Facebook page:
https://www.facebook.com/hope.cermelj

If I know what I shall find, I do not want to find it. Uncertainty is the salt of life. - biochemist Erwin Chargaff

---

Aloha, HOTPE. Mahalo. Hawaii News Now has a link, too.

http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/story/35388...ffiti-case

[Eric1600]

Is the argument being advanced that any finding of human remains on Maunakea, regardless of circumstance, denotes a sacred site?

Absolutely.

Is there physical evidence that there are burial sites of unique or special nature, e.g., royal and spiritual personages?

Some, but the origins and purposes are unknown.

Should the whole mountain top be off limits or just the specific burial site? (and by what site perimeter?) Just asking.

For the most part it is off limits to the general public, but using the honor system. Native Hawaiians can get permission for other traditional practices and in general can go where ever.

The summit area of Mauna Kea is very carefully curated and protected. People are paid just to make sure stones don't get moved around. In the past there has been problems with ahus and sacred stones (see the case of Kealoha Pisciotta which started her campaign). Many of the sites are recent (2000-now) but there's not much long term evidence that burials or any rituals were preformed at the top. Of the 100's of possible historic sites, there are 26 burials and possible burials identified within the Mauna Kea Science Reserve (MKSR).

I suggest you settle in and read the EIS studies if you want to get up to speed on the subject.

* TMT Final EIS Vol. 1 – http://www.malamamaunakea.org/uploads/ma...S_vol1.pdf covers the project description; environmental setting, impact and mitigation; alternatives to the project

* TMT Final EIS Vol. 2 – http://www.malamamaunakea.org/uploads/ma...S_vol2.pdf covers public comments from government, state, groups and individuals. This 541 page report addresses concerns and comments from 100’s of messages.

* TMT Final EIS Vol. 3 – http://www.malamamaunakea.org/uploads/ma...S_vol3.pdf of primary interest in this is Appendix D – Cultural Impact Assessment Report which covers cultural concerns about the TMT project including interviews with many native Hawaiians. This report is about 1100 pages.

[MarkD]

Thanks for your good overview, Eric. The previous discussion on Hawaiian DNA sites seemed to be getting a bit abstract.