TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo

[leilanidude]

Gypsy should be banned from this forum for multiple reasons. Is there no moderation of the rules?
----------------
I say let him stay. Just because someone doesn't appear as smart as oneself doesn't mean they aren't allowed an opinion even if you don't like their opinion.

[knieft]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Eric1600

Gypsy should be banned from this forum for multiple reasons. Is there no moderation of the rules?

---

Let the posts lie, lay, sit there. S/he will not have anything to laugh at. Done deal.

Cheers,
Kirt

[TomK]

Kirt,

When observatory staff are once again threatened with violence, the stuff Gypsy supports, we should just let it go?

No. He is PW's voice for the morons who want to kill or do violence against those working for the observatories on Mauna Kea, no matter who they are or where they grew up. No matter what you might believe from those protesting the TMT, there were people like Gypsy doing all they could to intimidate observatory staff and people working at the VIS and they included threats of violence and execution. I don't use that term lightly.

If you want people to simply ignore that, then please make your case, I'll listen. In the meantime, I think it is worthwhile pointing out the racist nastiness and threats of violence, as well as a lack of respect for law, that Gypsy represents.

[Guest]

Eric1600, is that what this allowing of time was for, healing the wounds and pain inflicted upon the Hawaiians over the TMT project, or for the Hawaiians to forget?
This TMT situation is much more than just another proposed pimple project for the oppressors. The Hawaiians are trying to reconnect and pick up their pieces of history and place them back together the best way they can, like a difficult jig-saw puzzle. The Hawaiians may want to use the summit region more in the next century or two for their new and old traditions, prayers, cultural gatherings, build new Ahu's, find peace, calm, strength, guidance, answers, and to connect with their ancestors. They may want to continue bringing bones and placentas on their own time. Thousands of tourists visiting the TMT and dozens of Hawaiians needing peace and calm may not mix all the time.
Is the proposed paper permit process only for Hawaiians to visit their land or for Tourists to visit someone else's lands?

https://qz.com/383415/astronomers-are-ke...n-volcano/

protectors practice Kapu Aloha to avoid violence.

http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/story/29418...newsnowcom

http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/story/29990...-mauna-kea

Eric1600, To my knowledge there hasn't been any astronomers arrested or harmed during this state, University and TMT caused situation.
Just because the state and TMT is doing their best to payoff or buy the Keaukaha and PUEO led Hawaiians may not mean the Majority is O.K with the current situation over the TMT project. jmo

[knieft]

quote:

---

Originally posted by TomK
If you want people to simply ignore that, then please make your case, I'll listen. In the meantime, I think it is worthwhile pointing out the racist nastiness and threats of violence, as well as a lack of respect for law, that Gypsy represents.

---

The case is simple, Tom. The content s/he posts is only intended to incite a response, and s/he gets the responses every time. S/he doesn't believe the things s/he posts. S/he simply gets off on screwing up any discourse the forum offers.

The more outrageous the posts, the more attention s/he gets. S/he knows you feel you must respond to the taunts, knows exactly what will piss you off. Any responses are a "win" and if the responses show anger and outrage s/he wins even more. It's clear to me that s/he simply thinks its funny to push buttons. Twisted sense of what people are for.

S/he doesn't need to be "debunked", s/he needs to be ignored.

I was tipped privately way back during the lava scare, when I was responding to his/her posts, that the troll lived in Leilani and that s/he wasn't the only one doing so. One poster even claimed to know him/her as a sort of neighbor. Some are "supporters" of her junk; some appear to be outraged. They may all be one person--I don't know. In any case, it appears to be a very mean-spirited sense of humor, londely attention-seeking, and/or a very anti-social sort of psychosis--s/he/they spend a LOT of energy on the disruption.

You can read every post s/he ever made as an attempt to get people pissed, not to forward an actual agenda. I can almost visualize him/her hooting in glee when people respond with outrage, taking the bait, thinking that reason will defeat unreason. The chain is jerked and jollies are had.

A thought experiment: S/he posts and no one responds--because the post is idiotic, because it is beneath contempt, because it contains ad hominem attacks, because of the history of the poster, because it is simply a thread hijack, whatever, but s/he jerks a chain and nothing resists it and no jollies available.

Or everyone can keep enabling him/her in the effort screw up any reasonable discourse on the forum. Rob can eventual ban the poster, but that won't likely stop the trolling. To my mind, the troll(s) are just the price of admission on Punaweb, or any forum on the web. I pay that price by ignoring it (except when I fall for it, I guess).

All of which is a too longwinded way to say: don't feed the trolls. It's not that difficult when you realize you're just being manipulated.

Now I'll go back to ignoring the whole issue...

Cheers,
Kirt

[Chunkster]

To summarize what knieft said:

Don't feed the troll!

[leo]

The more outrageous the posts, the more attention s/he gets. S/he knows you feel you must respond to the taunts, knows exactly what will piss you off. Any responses are a "win" and if the responses show anger and outrage s/he wins even more. It's clear to me that s/he simply thinks its funny to push buttons. Twisted sense of what people are for.

And it works. This thread should be renamed Trolls Anonymous. 116 pages and maybe half of this thread is the same 5 mud slinging. I don't know why Rob allows it. If you don't agree with what gypsy or what anyone else says, ignore it. Everyone has a right to their opinion.

[Chas]

..."116 pages and maybe half of this thread is the same 5 mud slinging."

True dat

[TomK]

Kirt - I appreciate your post and thoughts. I agree with pretty much all of your post other than it's all deliberate. I think much of it is, but not all of it. It's mostly trolling but some dangerous idiot stuff as well. His threats of violence in the past are not easily forgotten and those that work on Mauna Kea saw the same things from protesters. It's hard to ignore as are the blatant lies about my colleagues, friends and myself, but I'll do my best to ignore him from now on.

But my final thought right now: Leo, you wrote:

"If you don't agree with what gypsy or what anyone else says, ignore it. Everyone has a right to their opinion."

You contradict yourself. Yes, everyone has a right to their opinion, but you seem to think no one should reply with their own opinion. PW would be a very boring site if you couldn't reply to someone's opinion, but it seems that's what you want. Will you explain to us how you think this site should work if only a subset of people are allowed to post their opinions and others can't?

[leo]

Glad to respond TomK by saying reread my post again as a whole. It's about the mudslinging. I've read plenty of opinions on PT that didn't resort to mudslinging. Bullying anyone gang style while expressing one's opinion is disgusting and why it's tolerated is questionable.