why do we live(or come)here?

[Sean]

Hey, Glen violated the terms of the original post way back on page 1 -He's over 30, wait, so am I, darn. Oh, well I skipped from Glen's post to here just so I can exercise my punaweb privalege to futility.

Sean

[ric]

islandlvng's posts remind me of a delusional and frustrated teenager getting stupid drunk for the first time and trying to take on the world.

And DaveM, yes, I noticed the same thing, chris referring to island as 'her'. Wow, that's one angry woman. I think the only way we're going to get these d'bags to stop ranting is to ignore them. As fascinating an episode this is, I'm out.

[kimo wires]

A lot of petty bickering and emotional blasting on this thread which started out as a pretty straight forward question.

This should be a civil discussion.

Personal attacks never make anything better.
Nor does trying to correct someones grammar or spelling.

One should write in a forum online as if they were actually talking to someone they met on the street.

Would you speak to someone they way you write?
I do.

We should behave as if we might actually meet the people we speak to online.

Think about it.

Moderate yourself before Rob does it for you.

Having said that, I'll answer the Question.

I moved here because It was affordable.
Where else in Hawaii can one buy acerage at these prices.

I lived on Maui...Try that if you think this place is going down the tubes.

There's way less Racism/localism here.
People are frendlier.

Even surfing is less agro.

I love the the fact that it's still sort of Primitive.
It's not for everybody but It suits me just fine.

If you are unhappy with where you are it shows and
Your vibe will perpetuate the negativity.

Be content with where you decide to stay.
Take the Good with the bad.
No place on earth is perfect.

But some places on Hawaii island are.

[MarkP]

The original poster made several valid points and it is significant to me that he has spent so much time here as well as having traveled some. It stands out to me how many of us punawebbers are older or are mainland transplants. I am 48 and I grew up in central NY but I have lived here 20 years.

On the other hand it is part of human nature to seek out new things so it comes as no surprise that many people born and raised in Hawaii would move to the mainland as well as that retirees would move to Hawaii.

To answer the original question, I moved to Hawaii because my brother was out here. At that age Hawaii was beautiful and exotic. It still is on some level. I myself am less idealistic.

I bought property in Puna mostly because it was the cheapest land in Hawaii. In retrospect I did not research the purchase at all. However I have a personality well suited to Puna and I actually like many of the people I have found here, even considering that one of my neighbors is truly a weird hostile local. I suspect I am among a rare few.

Garbage comes up alot in describing problems in the islands and elsewhere for that matter. One thing that is different today from 20 years ago is the vast amount of consumer crap that gets bought then thrown away, not to mention the packaging. This alone has changed the landscape without people being any different. How could it not?

[KeaauRich]

Let me see if I can answer the original question with a simple and direct answer despite the fact that I do not fit the intended responder demographic.

I moved here because I have lived other places, and when I discovered this place, it felt right to me. I'm sure the first settlers of the islands felt the same way. This is not an absolute paradise - never was and never will be. But each of us seeks our own happiness in life, and my partner and I think we can find it here.

That doesn't make me a better person than someone who doesn't like it here - it just means we see things differently or want different things in life. It's not my job or my business to try to convince someone that this is the right place for them. And likewise, no one has the right or responsibility to assume that I can't see a place as it really is -- warts and all -- and try to convince me that I have made an error in judgment. Have I been the victim of some prejudice here? Maybe, but then again, so has everyone here - longtime resident or newcomer alike. But I've found in my life that if I treat folks the way I'd want to be treated, in general, they respond in kind. If you respect the environment, the culture and your neighbors, in general you'll be welcome here no matter what you look like or where you come from. And part of our responsibility as residents of the island -- whether our roots here go way back, or are just developing -- is to identify the problems of our home and then try to fix them.

It would be nice if we could turn back the clock and live in the idyllic days of the past. But if we could, I'm sure we'd quickly realize that things weren't quite so perfect -- or even better - then. There were just different problems. Likewise, it's not very productive for us to compare this place to that one, because everyplace has it's own unique advantages and disadvantages. Why anyone would choose to live in cold, damp, dismal Maine is beyond me, but I'm sure someone in Maine is saying "Why anyone would choose to live 3000 miles from 'civilization' -- on the edge of an active volcano to boot -- is beyond me."

So at the end of the day, we need to find a place that works for us, enjoy the good stuff, try to fix the bad stuff, and remember that we only get to experience but so many sunrises. Is it worth getting spun up because someone doesn't agree with us, doesn't see things our way, doesn't like us, or treat us fairly. In most cases, probably not.

Aloha

[centipede]

I'm 62, and having been around a bit myself, I agree with most of the pros and cons of living here. There is no paradise on earth but here on the Big Island, the pros crush the cons. It's the dead of winter, and I'd much rather be sitting outside in shorts writing my book with palm trees to look at than shoveling snow and driving in it. Nuff said.

[BobH]

I’m way over the limit.

I'll be 64 in March and have lived many places in the United States over my lifetime. The One thing I can tell everyone here that I know to be a Truth at least for me is this: If your reason for moving someplace is to find happiness in your life then the reason is flawed. And the other thing I can tell you is that all places have their challenges. I do not believe that there is a perfect place to live on the planet. However, if you are healthy inside with who you are and have a good sound insight as to why you exist at all, then you can be happy almost anywhere you choose to live. The problem for most is that people in general tend to think that: places" can make them happy. I do not believe that it works that way. You got to be happy first, then move anywhere you want to. (Some people in New Orleans wouldn't live anywhere else)

Some native Hawaiians are forever going to be unhappy about what happened to their “home”. But they are in many cases no different that All Native Americans. Peoples who have been defeated tend to hold bitterness about it for generations. Can you blame them? I cannot! Do I feel sorry for them? No I do not. It seems to me that most people on the planet have a defeat in their background at some time in the past. What seems to matter most is how those peoples decide as a group to handle it?

For example, the Filipinos have been conquered several times, most recently by the United States and yet they are some of the happiest people on the planet and do not hold generational grudges about it.

See what I mean?

I hope Islandliving stays put!

I have hope in my heart for the BI and want to think that good things are in the future and not just economic things.


Best!
BobH

[Chuysmom]

Wow. Upon my first peek at this thread there were no responses - then it's like Punaweb Superbowl.

You had to know that your inflammatory "observations" would cause one hot mess here. How could you not?

Whether or not I'm over 30, I am a member of this forum and can respond.

Reasons we moved to Hawaii and will continue to live here:

1. The weather is wonderful - we wanted rain coming from Arizona where it is very hot and not much rain.

2. Where we lived was sprawling very quickly, and the pace here is much slower - a welcome change.

3. The pollution was horrible (even with Vog, my mother's asthma is better here than in Arizona).

4. Look outside - it's gorgeous. Growing up in New York, I wanted some trees and green again.

5. We have more friends here than ever, many whom we consider extended family.

6. We wanted to experience the diversity that Hawaii has to offer. We learn something everyday about another culture.

7. We're learning that less is more because of our smaller home and the high cost of food and other items.


There are so many more reasons. We're not retired - and wont be for some time to come.



Carrie


"The world is changed. I feel it in the water. I feel it in the earth. I smell it in the air. Much that once was is lost, for none now live who remember it." Galadriel - LOTR

[EightFingers]

Some bring happiness on arriving, some bring happiness upon leaving.

Oh and one more:


If you are not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.

[freestate]

Reading the responses to this thread has been great. Islandliving does run a little hot, so much so that I thought he might just be trolling. But more likely he's angry about what he believes is happening to a place he loves.

What has been revealing is the nature of the responses from Punaweb. All have been pretty restrained from my perspective. I come from a part of the US where if you criticize things the usual response is "don't let the door hit you in the..." The whole America love it or leave it BS.

One of the things I perceive as positive about Hawaii is that I don't get the feeling that there is much hostility to gay people. I haven't heard of attacks, physical or otherwise, directed towards gays. See another thing that happens where I'm from is gaybashing from the good ol' country boys.

But the messages from KeaauRich and BobH do bring up some perceptions of mine.

BobH wrote in his first message an issue regarding hostility directed at he and his wife from locals. I mentioned something similar in my post. However I did not write my message in response to Bob's, he posted his thoughts while I was writing mine. I don't know Bob at all. So I don't think this issue is some random freak incident.

I really think this issue is an unfortunate consequence of the resurgence of Hawaiiana. Don't misinterpret, I think it/was necessary. Europeans have an unfortunate history of trying to eradicate local cultures and transplant theirs. One of the best things about the US, myth or not; is the idea of incorporating other cultures into what it means to be American. I know history has proven this is not always practice.

However I do get impression that the Hawaiiana movement accepts the attitude that unless you have "one drop" of Hawaiian blood you do not belong here. I can understand the reasons for this attitude but not the acceptance. I've seen it with my own racial group, when you have to work to prove that you are not lesser than the majority then its easy to say "in fact, we're better." Just as wrong, obviously.

I'm reminded of a documentary and discussion of Pidgin shown on public television recently. Some of the proponents of use of Pidgin were saying that the bare bones nature of the dialect in fact made it better than English. Its the "better than" thinking that is the problem.

And Bob mentioned the anger of losing one's sovereignty. Since Hawaii has been a state of only fifty years and lots its independence just over a hundred years ago I suppose there are still many living that remember when it wasn't part of the US and paint it as better. Think of how many paint the Fifties as a utopia. Hopefully this residual anger will fade with time but wonder if a side effect of the Hawaiiana movement is nurturing this feeling.

KeaauRich laid out his thoughts nearly verbatim to mine regarding perceptions of where people live. He didn't argue otherwise but this "Have I been the victim of some prejudice here? Maybe, but then again, so has everyone here - longtime resident or newcomer alike." brings something to mind. I don't think Rich was being an apologist, his phrasing just brought this up.

Prejudice seems to be very accepted here and this I will say is a problem. Its a problem for what prejudice leads to; discrimination, bigotry, racism. I'm not making the slippery slope argument. I'm arguing that if you want a true content-of-our-character society then casual statements of prejudice should be met with disgust, not chuckled away.

Hearing how locals talk about "Portugee this" and "Portugee that" and "well, their acting Samoan" or "well, their being Micronesian" openly is not cool. And hearing the "we're just open here" etc. is BS. These little innocent comments only continue the mindset of "those people", no matter how innocent. The fact this isn't shunned in this state seems to be another unfortunate side effect of rejecting "mainland" behavior to the detriment of the community.

Reminds me of hearing people make racist comments because they've forgotten I'm part of the group they're describing. But I was "one of the good ones, we don't mean you". That is the undercurrent of open prejudice.

Because I've tried to describe a couple of things I think are issues in Hawaii, don't misunderstand. I don't think this place is bad. We've met some really great folks here.

There are great people everywhere, thankfully. Big Island is no different.